[TheDullCarbide]

Ya know, I'm sorry, man. I can't find the time to measure my CDI. The RC thingy will have to wait. Stick to the "Stage one" build for now.

 

[MX-Z Man]

Keep this on topic and keep the personal stuff out.

Thank you for your cooperation.

 

[sightation]

Ya know, I'm sorry, man. I can't find the time to measure my CDI. The RC thingy will have to wait. Stick to the "Stage one" build for now.

Dullcarbide-

No problem with the calcs.

Plan at the moment is - Do the stage one. At the same time extend the wire from the Condensor out of of the engine to where the resistor is.

That way I can simply connect it later to see the effect

 

[RotaxFlyer]

No need to spend any more time ascertaining the commonality of taper.

All the 60's /70's Tapers are the same - see chart below. Use same flywheels- therefore same tapers.

Electric start models used different flywheels with mounting for ring gear. But same crankshaft so same taper.

As to the taper measurements - suggest you pull the flywheel from one of your engines and measure.

Thanks for the Info. So only the 277F Points Crank used a different Odd Ball Taper. Yes, I have a 340 Single lower end (Case & Crank) I got recently. Haven't unpacked it yet been busy. I was hoping to hear back from the Stator place. I sent them the Info on the Timing. He e-mailed back when I was on my way to branson and said he wanted to talk to me, I told him I was out of town and wouldn't be home for about 9 days but I haven't heard back. Sent a follow up e-mail asking if they got one done with Slots yet, but haven't heard anything back yet. Been busy on some other indoor projects in between Colds, so I haven't been out in the shop much. Weather is finally starting to warm up. So I'll get back working on it soon.

 

[RotaxFlyer]

Nope, that is not the flat curve CDI. That stock CDI has the 14* to 30* transition at 3500rpm. Sounds like you are doing the Stage 1 conversion and that is not the CDI you want.

On ScrappyDog, go in the second tab on the left, "performance parts," and click the top option in the list. It should say "125/150cc performance."

Scroll a bit until you see an orange version of the CDI you picked out. It should read "DC FIRED PERFORMANCE CDI." That's the one you want. Flat curve, no rev limit. $29.95

Make sure you DON'T get the one that just says "PERFORMANCE CDI."

For the coil, scroll just a bit more and you'll see an orange version of the coil you had. It should read "PERFORMANCE IGNITION COIL." This is the 1500:1 coil. $19.95

Make sure you DON'T get the one that says "RED HOT HIGH ENERGY GY6 IGNITION COIL."

Scrappy is a very good site for GY6s. I personally use Amazon, but hey...

Hey, you seem to pretty sharp on this Electronic GY6 stuff, and I'm not sharp on any Electronics, so bare with me. Do you think it possible to just use the Horse Shoe CDI Stator & Rotax 4 magnet Flywheel with one of these GY6 CDI Boxs and External Coil and Spark Plug Wire setup? Just change the Horse Shoe CDI connector for the GY6 Connector to plug into CDI Box? They give out the Wiring Connector diagrams for the GY6 stuff. Those Horse Stators for Seadoos are fairly cheap, $34-$55 New on eBay, that would help to reduce the cost for the conversion if just the GY6 CDI Box and Coil and Spark Plug Wire could be used. Probably give you a $70-$90 for the Conversion versus using all Nippon Aftermarket Stuff around $120-$140 or using some other combo setup.

 

[TheDullCarbide]

Hey, you seem to pretty sharp on this Electronic GY6 stuff, and I'm not sharp on any Electronics, so bare with me. Do you think it possible to just use the Horse Shoe CDI Stator & Rotax 4 magnet Flywheel with one of these GY6 CDI Boxs and External Coil and Spark Plug Wire setup? Just change the Horse Shoe CDI connector for the GY6 Connector to plug into CDI Box? They give out the Wiring Connector diagrams for the GY6 stuff. Those Horse Stators for Seadoos are fairly cheap, $34-$55 New on eBay, that would help to reduce the cost for the conversion if just the GY6 CDI Box and Coil and Spark Plug Wire could be used. Probably give you a $70-$90 for the Conversion versus using all Nippon Aftermarket Stuff around $120-$140 or using some other combo setup.

Is there a diagram for the Nippon stator? How would the Bosch flywheel work with the Nippon stator? I'm not too knowledgeable with the Nippon system.

 

[RotaxFlyer]

What's a GPL Starter? Were you thinking about using the GY6 flywheel with a starter??

GPL Starters bolt in place of Rope Pull Start. But they do make an adapter to bolt rope pull on it also. They make them for the 377, 440, 503, 470, 532, 582, 618, 670, but not for the 277 they say. I looked into the GY6 stuff, but to much work to make it work. The Bosch (4) Magnet Flywheel used with the Nippon Denso Horse Shoe Stater is the easiest way to do a Points to CDI. The Trick is, don't use Skidoo Parts, use Seadoo which are way cheaper. 580/587, 650/657 engines have the same connectors. Same for Electric Starters, use the Seadoo they're way cheaper. GPL Setup gives you a more compact setup.

In the 250 Type 247 Points to CDI Conversion, they drilled holes in the Horse Shoe Stater to reindex the Stator. Looking at Sightations photo of the Bosch Fly Wheel Bolts got me thinking. Instead of Drilling Holes in the Stator to reindex the Stator, why not move the Magnet Ring, then you could use the original Slots in the Stator Plate. The 335 Case Stud Bolt Pattern for the Stator Plate is based on 36 Bolt Pattern. TDC on Case to Stud Centerline is 10 Degrees. Once the Flywheel Magnet Ring Bolt Pattern is figured out, then you should be able to figure out where it needs to be placed. I have only looked at the 335/340 Case. Not sure if the 250 Type 247, 292, 299/300, 318/320 have the same Case Bolt Pattern. On my 277 Points Engine, the Flywheel Key pointed straight up, on the 335 the Key points to the 3-4 o'clock position.

If you shop around you can buy New Seadoo Stator cheap, CDI Box Cheap, and CDI Coil fairly cheap.

Seadoo CDI Stator $39.86
CDI Coil $40, I have seen cheaper around $29.
CDI Box $35.98

Total = $115.84 for all New Parts.

 

[RotaxFlyer]

Is there a diagram for the Nippon stator? How would the Bosch flywheel work with the Nippon stator? I'm not too knowledgeable with the Nippon system.

250 Type 247 Single Points to CDI kit using Holes to reindex it.

If you notice in the first photo bottom right the Stock Slot looks to be about the same Slot width from where they drilled the Hole. Since the Nippon CDI Ignition Fires at both TDC and BDC I doubt you would have to move the Magnet Ring very much. Something to think about.

Notice (4) Bolts look to be across from each other. 360/4= 90 Degrees. Notice Flywheel Key Centerline looks to point at the edge of the Magnet.

 

[RotaxFlyer]

Printable Degree Wheels you can Size. Print on Clear Transparency paper.

Degree Wheel Templates Valve Timing - Metric

Create adjust and print full scale degree wheel templates to check valve timing - Metric

www.blocklayer.com

 

[sightation]

Future reference for those reading this thread
The Sea-Doo stator assembly and Ebay 410918900 CDI box in Post #87 are not compatible. The CDI Box is for Ducati stators not Nipondenso.

Also - Rotax Snowmobiles used two style Nippondenso Horseshoe lighting coil stators - Dual and single ignition generator coils. Each uses different CDI boxes.

There are different CDI boxes with different timing curves for each generator coil type. Aftermarket CDI boxes replacing multiple OEM styles are often a compromise.

Some Correct Combos.
Early 80s
Dual generator coil 420866635
CDI Box 420866595

Mid 80's on
Dual Generator coil - 410912000
Cdi Box - 421911700
Cdi Box - 410913400 (single cylinder)
Cdi Box - 410913700

1990's
Single Generator coil - 410915200
Cdi Box - 410914900
Cdi Box - 410915800 (single cylinder)

 

[RotaxFlyer]

Future reference for those reading this thread
The Sea-Doo stator assembly and Ebay 410918900 CDI box in Post #87 are not compatible. The CDI Box is for Ducati stators not Nipondenso.

Also - Rotax Snowmobiles used two style Nippondenso Horseshoe lighting coil stators - Dual and single ignition generator coils. Each uses different CDI boxes.

There are different CDI boxes with different timing curves for each generator coil type. Aftermarket CDI boxes replacing multiple OEM styles are often a compromise.

Some Correct Combos.
Early 80s
Dual generator coil 420866635
CDI Box 420866595

Mid 80's on
Dual Generator coil - 410912000
Cdi Box - 421911700
Cdi Box - 410913400 (single cylinder)
Cdi Box - 410913700

1990's
Single Generator coil - 410915200
Cdi Box - 410914900
Cdi Box - 410915800 (single cylinder)

View attachment 2003291 View attachment 2003292 View attachment 2003293

Ducauti Ignition CDI/COIL combo, Nippon is separate. Seadoo 580/587 & 650/657 are Nippon CDI, there is Single Coil and Dual Coil just like the Sleds. Commonly called the Horse Shoe Stator.

Preferably you want the one that has the CDI Plug like the Skidoo's use.

The 250 Type 253, the 277, 377, 440, 503, use the same Stator & CDI Box, also the same as the Seadoo 650/657 and the 580/587, and I believe even the 717/720 used the ignition.

The 277F 1978 to 1981 used Bosch Points, 1982 to 1998/99 used Nippon Denso CDI, then switched to Ducati in 99/2000 till production ceased around 2008. All 277ULs were Bosch Points, but many were converted to CDI by Dealers.