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becasue it is so warm here, and no one is using all the heating fuel they thought we would they are adding a surcharge to NY customers: FOR NO USE!! *%@

From WIXT.com "The National Weather Service says this past January was the warmest ever on record. That probably means you didn't need as much energy to heat your home. So now, National Grid is tacking a surcharge onto your energy bill to make up for the difference."

so where does conservation get you?? anyone still think energy is controlled by the market?
 

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yup thats how them bastaerds werk they dont care bout us all they wanty is money$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
 

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ViperER said:
becasue it is so warm here, and no one is using all the heating fuel they thought we would they are adding a surcharge to NY customers: FOR NO USE!! *%@

From WIXT.com "The National Weather Service says this past January was the warmest ever on record. That probably means you didn't need as much energy to heat your home. So now, National Grid is tacking a surcharge onto your energy bill to make up for the difference."

so where does conservation get you?? anyone still think energy is controlled by the market?

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Stuff like this makes me want to live in a small cabin (off the grid) in the middle of no where ... preferably where there's lots of snow!!
 

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makes me happy that we are installing an outdoor wood burning furnace.. Screw the oil man and Bush
 

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Ive got good insight on this since I work in the electric generation industry in NY.. You can partially blame 2 things.. Environmentalists and Deregulation..in the '90s the tree huggers lobbied hard to cut coal and nuke generation in favor of "clean gas". Now about 60% of NY electricity comes from gas, this creates 2 issues. #1 it hogs gas for consumer use and drives up cost, raising our home heating bills dramatically( its a commodity traded daily) #2 as gas cost goes up so does electricity costs because gas being the largest fuel source for generation makes it lead the electricty costs, which is also a comodity traded daily in both day ahead and real time spot markets.. I work in a coal fired power plant and our profits are at record highs this year, why you ask? Because the deregulated environment created the daily trading and we're just another wholesaler in that market, since gas being the biggest source drives the market cost and coal is still dirt cheap in comparison, selling at market prices nets us a nice profit. We can watch the real time market update on monitors all over the plant, theres days( usually real cold or real hot) when electricity prices on the real time market are above $1000 per megawatt hour(mwh) with daily averages between $45-100mwh, its a very dynamic trading environment that can fluctuate wildly when megawatts get in short supply on high load days.. I figure the production costs are somewhere around $28-40mwh for most coal fired facilities. BTW ontario and quebec hydro sell at similar market prices as does the PJM market (Pa, jersey, maryland) Had deregulation still been in effect, profit margins would be controlled by the PSC, and the caol plants would bring down the average costs rather than make big margins when gas is high.. Today the psc only controls the transmission costs and customer service.. the actual comodity price is totally out of their hands. This all said and done, take a look at the itemization of your next electric bill, the cost to get it to you is still more expensive than the energy itself.
*%@ is up with that?
These gas issues is why GW Bush promotes clean coal.. its dirt cheap, we have an abundance of it thats really used for nothing else anymore and it benefits us in not only cheaper electricity but more coal used in electricity generation will cut gas usage and lower home heating costs too... But the tree huggers dont want to hear it.
 

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Sounds like you work at a Co-gen. Which company?

And another thing, lets see, it happened in the 90's (no Bush then) and now Bush want's to use more coal to lower costs? How dare you use rational facts when you could just blame Bush. Watch out, the Flaming Bush Haters will be after you.
 

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All I have to say is....."Oilheat is best".....

Many of you know what I do......

We are currently working on a program where our company, in conjunction with a major manufacturer, is going to run a contest for the month of March where the customer with the oldest hot water/steam boiler will receive a FREE boiler installation. Yes, FREE. It is part of our marketing to improve the image of oilheat over gas.
The gas company stickin' it to ya? Funny.....all our customers who are on contracts are paying EXACTLY what they agreed to....no MORE.....

Oil is still the best deal. It's warm, convenient, safe, and best of all, if you don't like your dealer or the price....you can get a new dealer and negotiate price.

And....service is there. Unlike the gas company, who has been mostly deregulated, most oil dealers in the Northeast provide service for their customers. In house service, so one call does it all.....fuel, service, repairs and installations.

We also accept "JOE-4-OIL" (Mass residents will know what this is), and all forms of fuel assistance. Try getting that from the gas company.

I think the above posts show that the gas and utility companies are putting their own needs first, above yours. The oil company I work at prides itself in providing courteous prompt service and delivery for our customers at a reasonable price.

Maybe a little off topic, but saw a chance to put in my morning rant and dog the gas company.


Jerry
 

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MX-Z Man said:
Sounds like you work at a Co-gen. Which company?

And another thing, lets see, it happened in the 90's (no Bush then) and now Bush want's to use more coal to lower costs? How dare you use rational facts when you could just blame Bush. Watch out, the Flaming Bush Haters will be after you.
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Co gen is really an obsolete term in NY. Since deregulation, all of NY power generation is "co-gen" these days, however larger plants like ours provide voltage support to the grid and are more of a necessity for system reliability while the small plants can go up and down on output with little effect on the grid, those are the co gens from the old days of regulation. I work at NRG dunkirk operations(formerly nimo) its a low sulpur coal plant on the western shore of lake erie, we burn about 7,000 ton of coal per day . Been there 17 yrs, 16 of them as an operator. I worked my way to the top in the control room then left last summer to be a mechanic/welder. Less stress and no shift work. Im too young to be sittin on my "edit for bad language" for 12 hrs at a time in a control room.
Im not a Bush lover . Im just pointing out that this is a case where the man makes perfectly good sense.
 

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oil and gasoline should not be allowed on the stock market as a commodity. it is a necessity of every day life and becomming a complete burden on people with long daily commutes. Bush has a few more years in office to continue to line his pockets... Hope all the Ford employees and every other American car manufacturer worker sends a thank you note to him while he is counting his kickbacks from Exxon Mobil.
 

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ViperER said:
becasue it is so warm here, and no one is using all the heating fuel they thought we would they are adding a surcharge to NY customers: FOR NO USE!! *%@

From WIXT.com "The National Weather Service says this past January was the warmest ever on record. That probably means you didn't need as much energy to heat your home. So now, National Grid is tacking a surcharge onto your energy bill to make up for the difference."

so where does conservation get you?? anyone still think energy is controlled by the market?

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This sounds like a bunch of BS but I know it happens. I don't have natural gas in my house, I use propane. My stove, hot water tanks and cloths dryer all use propane, so does my furnace but I also have a woodburner to heat my house. Last year my Propane supplier wanted to charge me a penalty because I used below what they consider their minimun usage for a year. It would have been cheaper for me to use about 200 gallons more last year then use just under their min. yearly usage. They have since backed away from doing this to me but I found it ridiculous to have to pay a penalty for not using enough energy. I have 50 acres of land with lots of hardwoods and my total propane bill for all of last year was 600 dollars because I heat with wood. Now I just have to put up a windmill and make my own electricity and then I can sell my surplus to my neighbors.
 

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Salty - that salt in my wounds thank you very much.....

I agree its deregulation - oil, gas, kilowatts... is all energy and a commodaty....
Wall street and those scared traders that jack up prices for no reason than one of them saw his shadow and ran and hid. The rest saw him and followed suit. So then the companies merely made exhorbanant profits off of that speculation. Its examples like this really make me hate free trade and our open system.
Energy is not the same as tomorrow's hog futures.
It should be regulated so that those not in that industry can prosper too.
 

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saltalarev said:
oil and gasoline should not be allowed on the stock market as a commodity. it is a necessity of every day life and becomming a complete burden on people with long daily commutes. Bush has a few more years in office to continue to line his pockets... Hope all the Ford employees and every other American car manufacturer worker sends a thank you note to him while he is counting his kickbacks from Exxon Mobil.
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I thought Jimmy Carter was responsible for the deregulation of petroleum in America, not Bush.

Please explain.
 

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Alaska has the largest natural gas reserves in North America. They hit so much of it drilling for oil they just pump it back into the ground.

Too bad our IDIOT governor (this guy really makes Bush look like a member of MENSA) can not negotiate a gas line deal. He is too busy flying around in his new jet the taxpayors disapproved. Of course Exxon doesn't want to invest in it; they are already making record profits.
 

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TT670 said:
Im not a Bush lover . Im just pointing out that this is a case where the man makes perfectly good sense.
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Thats why your posts are creditable, no BS, just soild information.
 
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