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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm still deciding on a ski-doo. I'm leaning toward a Skandic SUV. It do look a little too much like a work machine for my liking but I'm not sure anything else will do what I want it to do. I like the Skandic's storage ( I can get bags for the others) and articulating track. I need something great in deep snow. I want something for breaking trails myself - somethimes at slow speeds around tight woods and other obsticles. Something that won't be stuck or have to follow whenever I'm out with friends on their utility machines. I also want something for when I'm out with my buddies who own more sporty and touring machines. I want 2-up to be possile.
I'm now thinking of a renegade, summit 144" or a skandic SUV.

My biggest question about the renegade and summit::

How will it be breaking trails at slow speed? Will a touring machine be able to follow my track in deep snow of will I have to be digging ditches all the time? It's nice to beable to dig ditches whne you want but how are they if I slow down and try and leave behind a trail in tight woods that someone else can come over? Will I be able to start and stop in the deep without digging an hole?

Can I hook up a GPS to it's electrics - they don't have a battery right?

I believe the summit would be the better machine with it's longer track, lighter weight and wider skies but I believe that on a summit I'd have to add the short seat kit before I can fit the 1+1 seat. Any idea on the cost of this and how the short seat is comfort wise? Also how is the 2" paddle for noise? How do the track fair on trails - i've heard the paddles don't last when on hard trails??

Please send me any opinions - thought I better ask someone who owns one?

thanks
 

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I had an 88ish Tundra and used it for exactly what you are talking about, breaking trails in highly wooded areas... it worked great but don't try following your freinds on there muscle sleds afterwards. Therefore If I were you I'd get an old Tundra which you can probably get for dirt cheap and get a second sportier sled... one to break trail and one to have fun with!

The lighter sleds with a long and wide footprint will defenitely have more flotation... but long tracks need room to turn in the tight stuff.
 

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from what i know about the skandic suv model is the track is 20 inches wide, and 156 inches long. that will put more track down than the summit 162 i believe, and its a 1.25 track, which isn't too bad. the skis are 9 inches wide or more, vs. the summits 6.9 inch skis. as far as going slow through the woods the skandic will kick some butt, it has the two speed transmission and is made to haul stuff. the major disadvantage i see is its weight, at almost 650 pounds.

keeping up with your friends will probably be an issue, as the biggest motor the beast gets is a 600.

thats just my 2cents, hope it helps out. im sure someone else will be able to help you out with how the summit performs in slow motion, ive never owned one.
 

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one of the guys that I ride with has a tundrea. Its slow, but it doesnt get stuck. Its only the 390 single cylinder also very cheap under 5g's i think. He uses it for carving and just playing in the deep stuff, but thats just my $.02. I dont think its 2-up capable.
 

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A mountain sled and a utility sled are totally different beasts. The mountain sled is light and agile and is made for bombing up and down steep slopes and making powder turns in deep snow (narrow ski stance).

The Skandic is a heavy work sled with a ton of track but which you can't just throw around like a Summit. And if you get stuck on it you'll need help (or a winch!) getting out.

I dunno, if you're going to be hauling heavy loads or towing something, or going real slow all the time, you might want the Skandic.

But if you're just going to be hacking around, you might prefer the Summit. The Summit will float much better (much better power-to-weight ratio helps a lot here), and you can go more places on it. If you get stuck you can pull it out or float it out much more easily. It's much more dynamic riding and loves to jump and climb and stuff that utility sleds just can't do.

My 144" Summit (600SDI) with the 2" track is fine on hard pack, not too noisy, and the machine will get up to 90mph on the lake. I've bought scratchers but so far haven't installed them, and haven't had any cooling or hyfax problems yet. The hookup is awesome from the big track and sport sleds can't keep up with me in the mostly untracked snow we have around here. When exploring new areas (something I love to do) you can get down to ridiculous low speeds and still float, and you can lean it over and turn on a dime. I have intentionally let it sink into drifts to see how it behaves getting out of them. It just floats right out with a little gas. I haven't managed to get it stuck a single time yet, although I'm sure that will happen as soon as we get our deep March snow.

It's really comfortable on a bumpy trail with its very absorbent suspension, and although it's not as agile in turns on packed trails as sport sleds, it keeps up o.k. and feels perfectly comfortable. Try that on a utility sled.

In short, utility sleds are made for hauling heavy stuff and going slow. Going fast is one of the main points of snowmobiling, so I would never have bought a utility sled.

One problem with the Summit is like of a 1+1 seat, but I bet someone could cobble one together. I'm interested in this myself.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I want to have 1+1 capability so I guess its between the Skandic and the Renegade? Anyone know how the renegades compare to the Summit and Skandic off trail? Can they break a trail someone else can follow or do they have to be digging a ditch? Can they stop and start in the deep without digging a hole?
 

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No sled can stop or start in really deep snow without sinking and getting stuck. Any sled can skim on top of really deep snow if you're going fast enough.

Either Skandic or Gade can break trail. You'll have to keep the Gade going faster than you would a Summit to keep it from sinking, but a skillful rider can go a lot of places with a Gade. The Skandic will do better at low speeds, but it will handle much worse, will be much less fun to ride in a lively way, will be much harder to do a powder turn with, will be almost impossible to sidehill with, and when you do get stuck, and I mean WHEN, because we all do, it will be a b*t*h to get it out. Call the tow truck!
 

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In my opinion if you plan on using this sled for recreational purposes then stick with the renegade or the summit. Now if youre looking for strictly slow, hauling type of riding then get the skandic. So it boils down to If youre looking for a fast sled with trail breaking and 2up capabilities then I would definitely go for the renegade. If 2-up isnt a necesity then the summit, and for slow work type of riding the skandic. Me personally, I dont think I could ever own a skandic unless I had some other faster sled to ride. But thats just me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Sounds like a summit with a short seat kit and a 1+1 seat (this works right?) may be my best options. It will give me the deep snow capability and the sportyness?

Will it work as well as the skandic when I need to go slow in deep stuff to get around obsticles? Can it start off slow in deep stuff without digging a trench so that others (possible touring machines) can follow in the same path?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Deep snow/ trail breaking ability is more important to me than trail performance. I want something that can break trails like the skandic and still be a little or alot sporty on the trails and lakes

I'll never use it for work.
 

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Rev summit 550 fan

Its a modified SUPER tundra

You can tow with it

Its a great playing sled
I think it is your best bet

Buy a seat off ebay for cheap, and the two up extra is going to be the real chunk of money
 

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dan0471 said:
Sounds like a summit with a short seat kit and a 1+1 seat (this works right?) may be my best options. It will give me the deep snow capability and the sportyness?

Will it work as well as the skandic when I need to go slow in deep stuff to get around obsticles? Can it start off slow in deep stuff without digging a trench so that others (possible touring machines) can follow in the same path?

. . .

Deep snow/ trail breaking ability is more important to me than trail performance. I want something that can break trails like the skandic and still be a little or alot sporty on the trails and lakes

I'll never use it for work.
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Yes, the Summit is what you want. The Skandic has more track so it will be a little better at very low speeds and maybe when starting off, but the Summit will be much more maneuverable, will handle obstacles much better, and will be plain tons more fun in deep snow or in any conditions.

You asked about starting off slow in deep snow. Remember that no snowmobile can just drive like a car through really deep snow. If it's more than waist deep and/or it's real light fresh snow, every sled will sink in it when you get below a certain speed. So it's takes a certain amount of technique to stop and get started in really deep snow, and any sled will dig a trench if you just try to drive out. The Summit and Skandic need different techniques, and both require skill in really deep snow. The Skandic kind of crashes through, while the Summit needs to float up and skim. A heavy work sled like a Skandic with wide track and skis will crash through a couple feet of snow and make a trail. But it won't skim nearly as well as a lighter sled and if you put it in a drift, you're in real trouble. A Skandic's ideal element is not really off trail, but on a trail with a solid base which has a couple feet of fresh on it. If the snow gets deeper than that -- waist deep or deeper, it's hard to ride any sled. But here the Summit shines because you can horse it around and get it to skim on top of the snow. You can lean it over and turn it. AND, when (not if!) you get stuck, you can usually get it out by yourself, by lifting the butt around onto untrenched snow, and taking off with a little gas.

There's also the question of sidehilling, and hills in general. You can go a lot more places on a Summit because you can move across the face of a hill by pulling it over on one ski. Obviously, a Summit can go up and down vastly steeper hills than a Skandic -- that's what it's made for. A really strong, skilfull rider might be able to sidehill a Skandic, but that big beast is not the tool of choice for a situation like that, to say the least. A Skandic is really limited in rough or steep terrain; the Summit is much more capable in those conditions -- that's what it's made for.

The Summit does fine on trails and lakes, too. It has a narrow ski stance which makes it easier to lean over for sidehilling and powder turns, and this makes it more tippy on trails, so you can't corner quite as fast as short tracks, but it's not a dramatic difference and the 144" Summit is still fine on the trails and you won't hold back your friends on powerful short tracks. Let's put it this way -- the Summit is a whole lot better on trails than short tracks are off them. The Skandic would be a totally different story -- your friends would always be waiting for you to catch up.

The Summit will also climb and jump like a b*tch. It's made for that! And you can't do that on a Skandic. Even if you only have little hills or gravel pits or whatever, this is fun!

One disadvantage of the Summit is that if you ride in really low snow conditions, or on a totally smooth packed down trail, or on ice, the hyfax can heat up and melt, and you may have cooling problems. Aftermarket ice scratchers will fix that, but don't forget to put them back up before reversing! The wide (16") deep lug track (2" on the Adrenaline models) does hit the tunnel a little from time to time, but doesn't seem to make any extra noise on the snow. Obviously turning that track takes a lot more power than a shorter/narrower/shallower track, but I'm very happy with the acceleration and speed of my 600SDI. In our conditions all the power in the world won't help you if you don't have enough hookup.

Now the only problem is the seating for a passenger. I think Doo makes a 1+1 capable seat for the 550F Summit, but not for the others. I'll bet there's a way to make this work, though, because all the REV chassis have the same seat mounting points as far as I know. Maybe you could swap out the seat for one off a Gade Adrenaline, which is 1+1 capable.

Let us know what you find out because I might do the same to my Summit. I use my Summit for purposes a lot like what you describe. We ride in Russia where there are no groomed trails and where the snow gets really deep by the end of the season. I don't ride any mountains (like to try it though), but I love to explore new places where there are no trails or tracks or anything. The Summit is just beautiful for this -- it really floats over the snow, and being so light and with so much track it will just launch itself out of a drift if you do manage to sink a little. I go places I would never have dreamed of going before.

And on our "trails" (just rough tracks where other sleds have been going), the Summit does fine, too. Its massive hookup more than makes up for the slightly slower speed in turns, and the big track bridges and absorbs a lot of bumps. On our lake, I can't match the ultimate top speed of my friends' short tracks, but my sled accelerates faster (for its engine size) and will blast right up to 90mph, which is more than fast enough for me. You have to be insane to spend much time at such speeds.

The only real disadvantage for me is not being able to take a passenger, so I'll be looking forward to what you're able to find out about changing the seat. Good luck!

D*ckhead from Russia
 

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AKsnow said:
Rev summit 550 fan

Its a modified SUPER tundra

You can tow with it

Its a great playing sled
I think it is your best bet

Buy a seat off ebay for cheap, and the two up extra is going to be the real chunk of money
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Great sled, ultimate play sled, if you don't need ultimate power/speed.
 
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