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After all our discussions about off trail riding and how to stop it, one thing we can agree about is that the violators probably don't read forums and we are just preaching to the choir. Last night on the Rhinelander news station, they did a story on the subject which is much more likely to target the violators. Seems to me if we could find more ways to deliver the message (rather than snowmobile forums) like this one, it would go a long way. Maybe AWSC could part with some of their (our) money to fund advertising like this.

Hmmm.... A bit of north woods reporting here. Whoops....

Unless the off trail guys are correct and it is their right to go they want???

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After all our discussions about off trail riding and how to stop it, one thing we can agree about is that the violators probably don't read forums and we are just preaching to the choir.
Same as the reckless driving, drinking and riding, coming around corners in the middle of the trail, we are lucky to have none of those guys on Dootalk😂
 

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Perhaps the dealers and manufacturers need to be a part of the solution. They should not be selling the long track sleds outside of the mountain states.
Instead of chasing the short term dollar, operate with honor and protect the sport for the long term.
 

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Comical story that relates - I am the president of the snowmobile club here (Nisswa, MN) and last year the state snowmobile association (MnUSA) had their annual meeting locally to us, so thru all of the arrangements I was setup to lead a ride of state officials, DNR state managers, MnUSA members, etc... on a 2 hour ride in our area. General rule of thumb was 2 hour rides, 50-60 miles, run them a half hour or so between stops and give them 5 minutes to break.

So that being said - we run our first portion of the ride, about 20 miles at 40-50mph on well groomed, hilly / twisty trails and we stop in what is known as "The Pillsbury Forest", a 25,000 acre state forest on the west side of Gull Lake. Pretty much the only untouched forest area close to the city of Brainerd.

Everyone gets off for a couple of minutes, looks around at the scenery, a trail that runs along on a hillside. The hill to our left goes up another 40 feet to the top of the hill, the hill to the right goes down 15 feet thru some cattails off onto a lake that is 50-60acres in size. We went by multiple signs that say State Forest - Stay on Trail. Well, two DNR officers on state bought, DNR Arctic Cats get bored, fire uo their sleds half way thru the 5 minute wait and bust down trail, ride out across the cat tails and proceed to ride in 18-20" of untracked snow on that lake. They then ride up to the trail, and get in the back of the line.

Riding one sled behind me leading the 20 sled group is one of the state DNR big wigs from St Paul. He is just talking to a couple of other people like nothing happened. I walk back and ask him if he just saw what happened. He was perplexed, so I had to point out that the other two DNR officers decided to hop off trail, and ride across the lake while everyone was waiting - he mentioned it must have keen cool to be the first one to put tracks on the lake. I had to point out that riding off trail on grounds signed against snowmobile use is our #1 problem in the area, and obviously he and his officers were not plugged into what is going on in sledding in MN, and they dont understand the rules / laws they need to be enforcing. They were just up in Brainerd having a good time on the state's dime.
 

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Comical story that relates - I am the president of the snowmobile club here (Nisswa, MN) and last year the state snowmobile association (MnUSA) had their annual meeting locally to us, so thru all of the arrangements I was setup to lead a ride of state officials, DNR state managers, MnUSA members, etc... on a 2 hour ride in our area. General rule of thumb was 2 hour rides, 50-60 miles, run them a half hour or so between stops and give them 5 minutes to break.

So that being said - we run our first portion of the ride, about 20 miles at 40-50mph on well groomed, hilly / twisty trails and we stop in what is known as "The Pillsbury Forest", a 25,000 acre state forest on the west side of Gull Lake. Pretty much the only untouched forest area close to the city of Brainerd.

Everyone gets off for a couple of minutes, looks around at the scenery, a trail that runs along on a hillside. The hill to our left goes up another 40 feet to the top of the hill, the hill to the right goes down 15 feet thru some cattails off onto a lake that is 50-60acres in size. We went by multiple signs that say State Forest - Stay on Trail. Well, two DNR officers on state bought, DNR Arctic Cats get bored, fire uo their sleds half way thru the 5 minute wait and bust down trail, ride out across the cat tails and proceed to ride in 18-20" of untracked snow on that lake. They then ride up to the trail, and get in the back of the line.

Riding one sled behind me leading the 20 sled group is one of the state DNR big wigs from St Paul. He is just talking to a couple of other people like nothing happened. I walk back and ask him if he just saw what happened. He was perplexed, so I had to point out that the other two DNR officers decided to hop off trail, and ride across the lake while everyone was waiting - he mentioned it must have keen cool to be the first one to put tracks on the lake. I had to point out that riding off trail on grounds signed against snowmobile use is our #1 problem in the area, and obviously he and his officers were not plugged into what is going on in sledding in MN, and they dont understand the rules / laws they need to be enforcing. They were just up in Brainerd having a good time on the state's dime.
Hey love this story.
 

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Just up there is Munising, MI this past weekend,

IMO Michigan ought to ban the sales and installation of these mountain pipes. Yes they sound cool. Probably no performance gains but I will let the tec people speak to that. Recently bought 4 gen 5 xrs 137'. Had a blast! Thanks to the volunteers..

at the gas station there and heard someone bitching about why the trail to the town was not groomed.... well MF its because the volunteer has not been there yet.

My opinion on all this... people do not know about the volunteer work or anything what goes into trail systems. more education is needed, my .02
 

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Just up there is Munising, MI this past weekend,

IMO Michigan ought to ban the sales and installation of these mountain pipes. Yes they sound cool. Probably no performance gains but I will let the tec people speak to that.
Many of the states in new england have outlawed any exhaust modifications on sleds- has brought almost no change to the number of sleds riding with "cans"
 

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If over 80% of Wisconsin trails are trails across private property why would someone own a Backcountry or Freeride with those paddle tracks? Not bashing, just doesn't make sense to me.
One of my family members just bought a Yamaha with 2" paddles, basically because they live on a lake so deep snow out there can be fun - but when he trail rides he's not off trail at all (unless by accident.)
 

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Comical story that relates - I am the president of the snowmobile club here (Nisswa, MN) and last year the state snowmobile association (MnUSA) had their annual meeting locally to us, so thru all of the arrangements I was setup to lead a ride of state officials, DNR state managers, MnUSA members, etc... on a 2 hour ride in our area. General rule of thumb was 2 hour rides, 50-60 miles, run them a half hour or so between stops and give them 5 minutes to break.

So that being said - we run our first portion of the ride, about 20 miles at 40-50mph on well groomed, hilly / twisty trails and we stop in what is known as "The Pillsbury Forest", a 25,000 acre state forest on the west side of Gull Lake. Pretty much the only untouched forest area close to the city of Brainerd.

Everyone gets off for a couple of minutes, looks around at the scenery, a trail that runs along on a hillside. The hill to our left goes up another 40 feet to the top of the hill, the hill to the right goes down 15 feet thru some cattails off onto a lake that is 50-60acres in size. We went by multiple signs that say State Forest - Stay on Trail. Well, two DNR officers on state bought, DNR Arctic Cats get bored, fire uo their sleds half way thru the 5 minute wait and bust down trail, ride out across the cat tails and proceed to ride in 18-20" of untracked snow on that lake. They then ride up to the trail, and get in the back of the line.

Riding one sled behind me leading the 20 sled group is one of the state DNR big wigs from St Paul. He is just talking to a couple of other people like nothing happened. I walk back and ask him if he just saw what happened. He was perplexed, so I had to point out that the other two DNR officers decided to hop off trail, and ride across the lake while everyone was waiting - he mentioned it must have keen cool to be the first one to put tracks on the lake. I had to point out that riding off trail on grounds signed against snowmobile use is our #1 problem in the area, and obviously he and his officers were not plugged into what is going on in sledding in MN, and they dont understand the rules / laws they need to be enforcing. They were just up in Brainerd having a good time on the state's dime.
Just like most problems as of late, it's the enforcement of the rule of law and the subsequent penalties that are the problem. Those two clowns should've been fined.
 

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Just like most problems as of late, it's the enforcement of the rule of law and the subsequent penalties that are the problem. Those two clowns should've been fined.
The rules and laws that apply to us common folk, don't actually apply to law enforcement.
 
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Comical story that relates - I am the president of the snowmobile club here (Nisswa, MN) and last year the state snowmobile association (MnUSA) had their annual meeting locally to us, so thru all of the arrangements I was setup to lead a ride of state officials, DNR state managers, MnUSA members, etc... on a 2 hour ride in our area. General rule of thumb was 2 hour rides, 50-60 miles, run them a half hour or so between stops and give them 5 minutes to break.

So that being said - we run our first portion of the ride, about 20 miles at 40-50mph on well groomed, hilly / twisty trails and we stop in what is known as "The Pillsbury Forest", a 25,000 acre state forest on the west side of Gull Lake. Pretty much the only untouched forest area close to the city of Brainerd.

Everyone gets off for a couple of minutes, looks around at the scenery, a trail that runs along on a hillside. The hill to our left goes up another 40 feet to the top of the hill, the hill to the right goes down 15 feet thru some cattails off onto a lake that is 50-60acres in size. We went by multiple signs that say State Forest - Stay on Trail. Well, two DNR officers on state bought, DNR Arctic Cats get bored, fire uo their sleds half way thru the 5 minute wait and bust down trail, ride out across the cat tails and proceed to ride in 18-20" of untracked snow on that lake. They then ride up to the trail, and get in the back of the line.

Riding one sled behind me leading the 20 sled group is one of the state DNR big wigs from St Paul. He is just talking to a couple of other people like nothing happened. I walk back and ask him if he just saw what happened. He was perplexed, so I had to point out that the other two DNR officers decided to hop off trail, and ride across the lake while everyone was waiting - he mentioned it must have keen cool to be the first one to put tracks on the lake. I had to point out that riding off trail on grounds signed against snowmobile use is our #1 problem in the area, and obviously he and his officers were not plugged into what is going on in sledding in MN, and they dont understand the rules / laws they need to be enforcing. They were just up in Brainerd having a good time on the state's dime.
They should be ashamed of themselves. Props to you for pressing the issue. Hopefully they reflected on that moment and will doo the right thing going forward.

Had to edit after I sent this... In MN there is a rule that if a body of water is within so many feet of a right of way, you have legal ingress. Maybe they applied the rule to the trail? I know; I'm reaching here...
 

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Perhaps the dealers and manufacturers need to be a part of the solution. They should not be selling the long track sleds outside of the mountain states.
Instead of chasing the short term dollar, operate with honor and protect the sport for the long term.
Very valid point and a big driver in the off trail concern. The challenge is off trail is illegal in most states but not all, however with landowner permission you can ride off trail in those states so you can't not sell or not allow registration in any state. The manufacturers I'm sure make a lot of money making these sleds. With that it comes down to policing and enforcement. Many states are payroll strapped in these departments so do we raise taxes to hire more officers? Do we outsource this policing to a third party which will charge equal or more? Do we increase snowmobile fees? Those options consistently receive a very strong "no" from the public.
 

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I'm a land owner myself with a trail going across my property. I've never had issues with trespassing, but this season has been horrible with those stupid "trail" cans.
Only NEWB's put cans on trail sleds. Stupid products that should just be removed from the market.
Hey, quiet & fast is the new cool! Don't kid yourself.

Know this, if you have a can - when you pull up off the trail or at a gas stop - virtually everyone thinks you're a retard......except for the other NEWB's.
 
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