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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Was out riding yesterday and two guys pulled up beside me at the gas station and asked if I would be willing to race my Mach against their sleds. They had a stock 03 F7 and a 03 REV 800 with pipe/shaved heads/clutch kit on it. We lined up on the railroad bed between Strongs and Raco. After we raced we stopped and talked for awhile and they said off the line I jumped out about 3 lengths, stayed there through mid and then walked away on top end. After we talked sleds for awhile we lined up again with the same results. I wouldn't normally post about beating smaller sleds but after hearing about the F7's running with Mach Z's I decided to share my experience, especially because the 03 F7 is supposedly the fastest one made. The guy riding this one said he had never been beaten off the line like that by any sled. The guy on the REV 800 said he had to pipe/clutch and mod his motor just to run with his friend's F7. They were staying in Brimley and were just out looking for sleds to race against, good guys to ride with. The guy on the F7 said he had been reading internet posts where guys were claiming to run right beside Mach Z's with their F7's so he wanted to find out for himself. Now he knows.
 

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I wish cat made a better sled cuz their 700 just down right hauls the mail. 700 with a little work it'll probably out run the Z and it's ONLY a 700. I own a Z and just giving credit where credit is due. However, the first corner the F-cat is in the sticks cuz they don't handle for crap.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I agree Kirch the F7 is fast for it's size and will still mop up most 800's. I'm not bashing it.
 

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i agree with your statement. the mach z in stock form with the clicker set in the appropriate position will beat both a stock f7 and a 800ho rev with mods. i happen to own both a 05 mach and a 04 f7. last yr the f7 was a real strong performer with basic mods like clutch, pipe, reeds, and 153 studs. was beating my mach during the beginning of the year until i turned my clickers from #6 to #2. i would bet alot of apex's and f7's that claim to beat these machs are running against clueless owners who dont even know what a clicker is, and still probably have them in factory setting. however, i will warn the mach owners that more and more of the f7 owners seem to be doing motor work like porting, head mods,timing keys, and boondockers or adj fuel regulators, which is bringing these light sleds into the mid to upper 150hp numbers safely on pump gas. this yr i decided to see how well i could get my 04 f7 to perform with motor work, and dyno tuning. got the sled safely up to 158hp on pump gas, and clutched accordingly for dyno results. i will say now that the mach is no match for the f7 in any race up to 1500ft. mach still has it beat in top speed though: 123.2 versus 119.8mph for the f7. both speeds achieved on same day, same plowed lake, same calibrated stalker radar gun. dont get me wrong, mach with same mods will no doubt beat a f7 with these same mods done to both, but it just seems at least around here in ny, that we see alot more modded firecats than doo's. but in a long run u cant compare to the torque of the big 1000 twin, she has long legs(without the 05 updates)
 

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Well I happen to own both a Mach Z X and a Firecat 700 and let me tell you the Firecat that has a timing key, mild porting, vforce, big air inlet and it will go on by a Mach Z on the big end.

I just came from the lake and showed a fellow member what this Firecat will do against his Mach Z. My Firecat is 154 HP and power to weight wins. If you got more than 154 then you are missing something in clutching or gearing that will not make you run a better number than the Mach on radar as mine was as good or better then the Mach today.

I am disgusted at this in a way as the big torque lake runner Mach was suppose to rule but so far it does not.

Spike
 

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spike, i didnt mean to come across like the mach would go right by the f7 past 1500ft. i guess i was just trying to get my point across about how fast a 700cc firecat can be, without stepping on too many toes of mach owners, so i put in good points about both the sleds, this is a doo sight so i didnt want to rave about how much better the f7 is than the mach. i like things about both of them. but u are right in being disgusted in the fact that a well tuned f7 is noticably faster than a 165hp mach. truth is that 119.8 mph run on the f7 was achieved last yr with only clutching, pipe, and reeds with stock 1" track. havent seen a good top speed area to run yet this yr since the motor mods to the 7, but do doubt with 15-20 more horse than last yr, set up right the f7 should go into the 120's no problem. and the f7 so far this yr keeps pulling on the mach for the full time. i'm sure sometime this yr i will be able to run these side by side for a truly long enough distance to see, but so far this yr i havent come across a distance yet in which the mach can catch the f7.
 

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Dont worry to be honest I feel the Mach should go right by the Firecat and if you asked me that last year that is what was happening more than not. I would have argued with anyone the Mach would walk top end bye a Firecat and mine did or at least the ones I raced.

This year is a whole new ball game and we have had plenty of space to unwind them on the lake the past few times out. Not the fastest conditions today but I got a 116 on my GPS in just a dusting of snow on the lake and warmer temps. The Mach 115. Now my 700 has work but it is my wife and daughter sled. If you think the Firecat is fast as a 700 you should see the Engine Tech 900 in my buddies and it is not contest with the Mach.

I have a hard time believing there is not something holding back the Machs this year and unless BRP does know we know there is something and we are mad as hell about it ranting to our dealers trust me when I tell you many Mach Z owners will see the flap of a F7 and will watch a F9 just walk away from them.

This is truly disappointing in my mind.

Spike
 

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once again i agree totally with u. my buddy has a d&d f9ss making over 200hp on the bottle. the think flat out rips. i havent personally seen the engine tech kit run but hear good things. the bmp kit from what i have seen is good as well. bottom line is all the big bore f series sleds will run when put in the hands of a capable tuner, doesnt matter dd, bmp, or engine tech, they're all close when set up properly. i'm near dd so i see more of their stuff up here in upstate ny, but myself, dont have 1 piece of dd equipment on my sled, and its not due to anything, just like to be a little different. i just didnt think i would have to try so hard to get my mach to be able to go by my f7. i dropped alot of coin in the mach to buy it, and feel i shouldnt have to start changing clutching and whatever else will make this thing go, just to get it quicker and faster than my well tuned 700. i have seen 1 or 2 very fast machs, but they both had wahl bros drag suspensions, bored and on nos, and still the f9's would be right there with it. i guess i like most others am frustrated that we have to try so hard to make a 1000cc, 165 hp sled run with smaller cc sleds.
 

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Hey guys, I'll give cat credit the F7 is a runner. But Ski-Doo finally did there home work. My bud has a new 800 P-Tec it plain old hauls the mail. Shows the snow flap to my brother in laws F7 every time, and he's not happy about it. this is the first stock 800 Doo to doo it. I had a mxzx 800 if I had known they finally kicked he 800 in the nuts I may have bought one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Some of you guys aren't comparing apples to apples. Comparing F7's with timing keys, pipes, clutching, motor work or big bore kits isn't a fair shake. How can you be disappointed if a much lighter sled with nearly the same hp is outrunning you? For the average joes that go buy sleds and ride them stock, which most do, the sleds come as advertised. The Mach Z will absolutely smoke an F7 if both are stock, period. To say that you are disappointed with the Mach for losing to a high mod lighter sled is ridiculous.
 

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zert said:
Some of you guys aren't comparing apples to apples. Comparing F7's with timing keys, pipes, clutching, motor work or big bore kits isn't a fair shake. How can you be disappointed if a much lighter sled with nearly the same hp is outrunning you? For the average joes that go buy sleds and ride them stock, which most do, the sleds come as advertised. The Mach Z will absolutely smoke an F7 if both are stock, period. To say that you are disappointed with the Mach for losing to a high mod lighter sled is ridiculous.
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Ditto!!
 

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The point of all this is the Mach has been represented and sold as a lake racer. Whne it struggles on top end and a stock, yes a stock F7 that is clutched and geared properly - no different than the Mach except the Mach is not geared - they will be right with the Mach. To me that is the disgusting point as a Mach owner and puts a grin on my face as a Firecat owner. Now you dont even need to port the F7 just add a timing key and you may go by that Mach.

If you feel that is right then that is your perrogative. Not comparing apples to apples is that the excuse you use when you lose to a little 700. I bought this Mach to be able to fine tune and be as advertised King of the Lake. It is not.

Spike
 

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SPIKE said:
The point of all this is the Mach has been represented and sold as a lake racer. Whne it struggles on top end and a stock, yes a stock F7 that is clutched and geared properly - no different than the Mach except the Mach is not geared - they will be right with the Mach. To me that is the disgusting point as a Mach owner and puts a grin on my face as a Firecat owner. Now you dont even need to port the F7 just add a timing key and you may go by that Mach.

If you feel that is right then that is your perrogative. Not comparing apples to apples is that the excuse you use when you lose to a little 700. I bought this Mach to be able to fine tune and be as advertised King of the Lake. It is not.

Spike
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it does suck that the mach isnt faster stock, however, if your talking modified to modified, i have a friend,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,make that 3, that i have a feeling a f7 wouldnt even get a sniff of there machs on the top end,,,,,,just my 2cents. and if im wrong, id love to see it
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Spike, these sleds aren't sold with a handbook on how to make them faster. You are saying that a stock F7 with clutching and timing key will run with the Mach. News flash.......THAT ISN'T STOCK MY FRIEND. Take a F7 out of the box and a Mach out of the box and it will be an azz whoopin put on by the Mach out on the lake.
 
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