If you read closely you will see the punctuation in my title leaves lots of wiggle room
Everyone knows it by now, most Mach Z's seem to be revving too low. Other models seem to be doing a bit better with some more than others....today I was able to rule out some things.
Most here know the backstory, but I will briefly fill anyone new in.
Dano and I got new 900rs. His Adrenalin and my Mach Z. First real day out riding(lake only) he revs 8000 and settles in at 7900 much of the day on a lake with 8" fluff. My Mach same day only manages to rev 7600 for split second then settles in at 7500. This was a colder day around -15c(5f). At the end of that first day, we both had around 50 miles on ODO. Needless to say, the machine revving correctly would walk the other and have an approx 5mph difference on the top end(GPS). But the RPMs are what this thread is about, not speeds.
Went for a 2nd ride the next day, this was all trail. Pretty much the same thing, adrenalin revving correctly around 7900 and Mach revving at 7500. Now at end of that day, we both have close to 140 miles on ODO.
When swapping sleds as we do often, I could instantly feel the lower engagement, and how much harder it grabs the belt and moves the sled NOW! Mach with that flat section on-ramp comes in 'Soft' and sorta lazy IMO. This feeling continues to about 1/3 throttle. Making the base cheaper ADR feel much more connected to the snow, and also "quicker" down at the bottom.
So I decided to test his 880 ramps on the Mach since all else is equal between these two models. ADR, X, XRS all come with 880 ramps while the Mach comes with 897 ramps. The biggest difference is the flat section at the heel(engagement) which raises engagement rpm to help with Launch Control. Having the quick change ramp tool, and also the Pin removal tool from Chris at C&T Powersports made this ramp change a less than 10 minute job. Got it down to under 60 seconds to pull a ramp. Everyone with a pDrive clutch should own this tool!
I removed the 880 ramps from Dano's sled, and today installed them into my Mach. I let the sled warm up(but not too hot) to approx 110f. It's a MUCH milder day today then the previous 2 days I rode my Mach stock. Today was -2c(28f) and my lake has some slush in many areas, but not deep slush.
On my road to the lake, I cracked it WOT for a quick shot, unstudded(still) track spun on my hard-packed/icy road instantly hitting 7800. Short road so it was just a quick shot. Enter onto my lake and I have a section approx 2000ft shoreline I like to run. The First 4 runs back and forth, the Mach now revs to 7800 on the hit, then settles to 7700. Far better then the 7500 before(on a colder day). After about 4 runs I saw my temp was now over 180f so I decided to try the Launch Control. LC does still work with the 880 ramps but in a far lesser capacity. It will only hold revs around 3k so not nearly as high and does not hit as hard. So this is why those Mach ramps are needed. As I suspected.
I like the 880 ramps MUCH better overall, from bottom engagement feel(even at 2700) to mid, to top. So I am very happy to have my Dalton adjustable ramps arriving soon from Chris at C&T. The curve on the Daltons will be much closer to the 880 ramps and no flat spot. I could care less about LC and I'm sure I can always raise RPMs with a spring if I really want later. Adjustable will allow me to add/remove tip weight and mid/heel weight to my liking, getting the Mach to rev correctly, and "IF" the RPMs come up by some miracle, I can simply add slugs back into the Daltons at that time. Been running dalton adj weights in most every sled I have owned since the early 2000s, another must-have IMO.
NOTES:
I did check over a few other things today for peace of mind. I removed the IC to check the drain plug on the front bottom corner(chain side) and was able to tighten that finger cap with a T40 Torx about 1/4 turn, but I don't feel it was leaking at all...just was something to check for.(Thanks Phil!)
I also made note of the "play" in the throttle lever. I noted the Adrenalin has far far less play(likely due to no FAR cable routing), while my Mach has a fair bit. So when riding WOT I used my left index finger to press on the exposed cable, taking all the play out til it was taught, and not one single RPM change. So another nonissue.
My takeaway is that Dano's sled while revving higher, was a colder day. And likely today he may have revved a tad less, I'm thinking 7800 rather than 7900. And for mine to rev 7800 and 7700 today with his ramps, I feel my Mach is basically where it should be. In other words, I do not think I have any boost leaks etc. I did go over all clamps and all are tight.(2nd time)
I honestly think BRP designed the 897 ramps all around the launch control and did not pay nearly enough attention to the rest. Studying both these ramps side by side it's plain to see the Mach has more tip weight and less heel weight, and so it's revving lower on top. And the flat section at the heel for LC IMO makes this sled feel very lazy. These will be going in a box as soon as my Daltons arrive.
See video below
Dan
Everyone knows it by now, most Mach Z's seem to be revving too low. Other models seem to be doing a bit better with some more than others....today I was able to rule out some things.
Most here know the backstory, but I will briefly fill anyone new in.
Dano and I got new 900rs. His Adrenalin and my Mach Z. First real day out riding(lake only) he revs 8000 and settles in at 7900 much of the day on a lake with 8" fluff. My Mach same day only manages to rev 7600 for split second then settles in at 7500. This was a colder day around -15c(5f). At the end of that first day, we both had around 50 miles on ODO. Needless to say, the machine revving correctly would walk the other and have an approx 5mph difference on the top end(GPS). But the RPMs are what this thread is about, not speeds.
Went for a 2nd ride the next day, this was all trail. Pretty much the same thing, adrenalin revving correctly around 7900 and Mach revving at 7500. Now at end of that day, we both have close to 140 miles on ODO.
When swapping sleds as we do often, I could instantly feel the lower engagement, and how much harder it grabs the belt and moves the sled NOW! Mach with that flat section on-ramp comes in 'Soft' and sorta lazy IMO. This feeling continues to about 1/3 throttle. Making the base cheaper ADR feel much more connected to the snow, and also "quicker" down at the bottom.
So I decided to test his 880 ramps on the Mach since all else is equal between these two models. ADR, X, XRS all come with 880 ramps while the Mach comes with 897 ramps. The biggest difference is the flat section at the heel(engagement) which raises engagement rpm to help with Launch Control. Having the quick change ramp tool, and also the Pin removal tool from Chris at C&T Powersports made this ramp change a less than 10 minute job. Got it down to under 60 seconds to pull a ramp. Everyone with a pDrive clutch should own this tool!
I removed the 880 ramps from Dano's sled, and today installed them into my Mach. I let the sled warm up(but not too hot) to approx 110f. It's a MUCH milder day today then the previous 2 days I rode my Mach stock. Today was -2c(28f) and my lake has some slush in many areas, but not deep slush.
On my road to the lake, I cracked it WOT for a quick shot, unstudded(still) track spun on my hard-packed/icy road instantly hitting 7800. Short road so it was just a quick shot. Enter onto my lake and I have a section approx 2000ft shoreline I like to run. The First 4 runs back and forth, the Mach now revs to 7800 on the hit, then settles to 7700. Far better then the 7500 before(on a colder day). After about 4 runs I saw my temp was now over 180f so I decided to try the Launch Control. LC does still work with the 880 ramps but in a far lesser capacity. It will only hold revs around 3k so not nearly as high and does not hit as hard. So this is why those Mach ramps are needed. As I suspected.
I like the 880 ramps MUCH better overall, from bottom engagement feel(even at 2700) to mid, to top. So I am very happy to have my Dalton adjustable ramps arriving soon from Chris at C&T. The curve on the Daltons will be much closer to the 880 ramps and no flat spot. I could care less about LC and I'm sure I can always raise RPMs with a spring if I really want later. Adjustable will allow me to add/remove tip weight and mid/heel weight to my liking, getting the Mach to rev correctly, and "IF" the RPMs come up by some miracle, I can simply add slugs back into the Daltons at that time. Been running dalton adj weights in most every sled I have owned since the early 2000s, another must-have IMO.
NOTES:
I did check over a few other things today for peace of mind. I removed the IC to check the drain plug on the front bottom corner(chain side) and was able to tighten that finger cap with a T40 Torx about 1/4 turn, but I don't feel it was leaking at all...just was something to check for.(Thanks Phil!)
I also made note of the "play" in the throttle lever. I noted the Adrenalin has far far less play(likely due to no FAR cable routing), while my Mach has a fair bit. So when riding WOT I used my left index finger to press on the exposed cable, taking all the play out til it was taught, and not one single RPM change. So another nonissue.
My takeaway is that Dano's sled while revving higher, was a colder day. And likely today he may have revved a tad less, I'm thinking 7800 rather than 7900. And for mine to rev 7800 and 7700 today with his ramps, I feel my Mach is basically where it should be. In other words, I do not think I have any boost leaks etc. I did go over all clamps and all are tight.(2nd time)
I honestly think BRP designed the 897 ramps all around the launch control and did not pay nearly enough attention to the rest. Studying both these ramps side by side it's plain to see the Mach has more tip weight and less heel weight, and so it's revving lower on top. And the flat section at the heel for LC IMO makes this sled feel very lazy. These will be going in a box as soon as my Daltons arrive.
See video below
Dan