Nice. I would be interested in buying that post if easily avail. for the Mach. Not that I really need it but the OCD brain would feel good about it..lol
Thanks for part number brother
Dan
Posts by rockerdan
61 - 69 of 69 Posts
Thanks for part number brother
Dan
100% brother
That is awesome. I don't doubt that some out there work out well. But I also think after several yrs on TY and my own experience owning one and being towed home and having to tear that sled down that the majority of 998 owners come away with little confidence in their engineering. After so many yrs it would make sense that the newer ones should have lots of the issues fixed, and maybe they are better now?
I really don't intend to "dis" the 998 sleds, after all it was by far the fastest sled I had ever owned once tuned. But I think I just tend to compare this DOO Turbo to the 998 turbo cause they are similar. For what its worth I remember saying in 2020 how much more I liked my 850 doo compared to my Winder as well, but that was more about the nice easy lightweight handling manners.
In the end, there are always guys who love their sleds and have no issues, and that is great for everyone. But i think even cat guys will agree the DOO is a much more reliable sled overall with much better engineering.
Dan
Chris yours is gonna be a rocket! There is no doubt, if you want big speed the 998 is king...998 guys will always be able to say that!
Hey guys....wow, I have been out riding and come back here to see all kinds of action! LOL.
Just got caught up on 3 or 4 pages of reading....Got lots more miles on and have been waiting for clutch parts to arrive, which just came in today!
Not sure why some guys are all upset with me, but I was just trying to weed out the reason my RPMs were so low initially. So swapped the Mach ramps to 880s(adr,X,Xrs ramps). This one test alone was the most worthwhile test IMO. There is such a difference in the 880s vs the 897s, and if I was gonna buy only one clutch item, it would be the 880 ramps for the Mach. I continue to think the 897s were designed around LC period.
That being said, I never was DONE with the tuning. I know full well what this clutching is lacking and have been waiting for parts. I also want to run the Ultimax. Im pretty sure I have explained this before in this thread but reading along the posts just go so far off from where Im going. I understand its a forum and this happens, and yes I am throwing theories out there of ECU pulling back, maybe so or maybe not? But I'm still in the middle of clutching this Mach.
I did find a fair amount of slippage in the secondary since we now have more miles on. I felt from the beginning this was happening and can clearly see it now, and so my hunch in the parts I ordered a while back should work out.
While I do think the rpms need to come up(I was at 7500), we did find enough test time to show 8000 vs 7700 on top end the top speeds are ultra similar. I think 7700 on long hauls once heat soaked is OK, and should not be lower. I would prefer 7900 though. 880s ramps seem to like that zone.
So for me, this is what sledding has always been about. Dialing in the clutching. No different then any other sled I have owned. Only difference is now there is the internet and I enjoy posting if I find gains I like, so others can try them out.....I do feel these 4strokers are setup more for touring type power, and MPG. Where as the 850s are clutched for pure corner to corner jam. So there is alot to be changed to get these to feel much more fun corner to corner, and for me I enjoy engine braking alot too.
I understand you can never please everyone, i get it. Anyone who cares where I end up Im an open book. PM me anytime. Im sure guys with spring changes will get close, and be alot cheaper. These 4s are very forgiving on top RPM range, however I am trying to make this more of a corner to corner biased sled.
Have a good day gang, life is short and I really do like to keep a positive attitude! I think the Mach is a blast so far, impressing me in way more ways than I had expected, and while the TOP SPEED is not where I would have wanted, the rest of the '22 Mach experience far exceeds! This will be fixed with a tune(fingers crossed) or I will be talking to Dave or Chris by next fall for the Hurricane standalone.
Dan
Just got caught up on 3 or 4 pages of reading....Got lots more miles on and have been waiting for clutch parts to arrive, which just came in today!
Not sure why some guys are all upset with me, but I was just trying to weed out the reason my RPMs were so low initially. So swapped the Mach ramps to 880s(adr,X,Xrs ramps). This one test alone was the most worthwhile test IMO. There is such a difference in the 880s vs the 897s, and if I was gonna buy only one clutch item, it would be the 880 ramps for the Mach. I continue to think the 897s were designed around LC period.
That being said, I never was DONE with the tuning. I know full well what this clutching is lacking and have been waiting for parts. I also want to run the Ultimax. Im pretty sure I have explained this before in this thread but reading along the posts just go so far off from where Im going. I understand its a forum and this happens, and yes I am throwing theories out there of ECU pulling back, maybe so or maybe not? But I'm still in the middle of clutching this Mach.
I did find a fair amount of slippage in the secondary since we now have more miles on. I felt from the beginning this was happening and can clearly see it now, and so my hunch in the parts I ordered a while back should work out.
While I do think the rpms need to come up(I was at 7500), we did find enough test time to show 8000 vs 7700 on top end the top speeds are ultra similar. I think 7700 on long hauls once heat soaked is OK, and should not be lower. I would prefer 7900 though. 880s ramps seem to like that zone.
So for me, this is what sledding has always been about. Dialing in the clutching. No different then any other sled I have owned. Only difference is now there is the internet and I enjoy posting if I find gains I like, so others can try them out.....I do feel these 4strokers are setup more for touring type power, and MPG. Where as the 850s are clutched for pure corner to corner jam. So there is alot to be changed to get these to feel much more fun corner to corner, and for me I enjoy engine braking alot too.
I understand you can never please everyone, i get it. Anyone who cares where I end up Im an open book. PM me anytime. Im sure guys with spring changes will get close, and be alot cheaper. These 4s are very forgiving on top RPM range, however I am trying to make this more of a corner to corner biased sled.
Have a good day gang, life is short and I really do like to keep a positive attitude! I think the Mach is a blast so far, impressing me in way more ways than I had expected, and while the TOP SPEED is not where I would have wanted, the rest of the '22 Mach experience far exceeds! This will be fixed with a tune(fingers crossed) or I will be talking to Dave or Chris by next fall for the Hurricane standalone.
Dan
Not even close on mine. It loses 150-200 only, so a few tweaks and you have the best belt in biz. Sheaves went from black to clean. 571 is worst for slippage, Ultimax is best for no slippage.
For you to rev 7200 only, you must been only 7400 stock 571 belt.
Dan
Lots of ways to clutch guys....obviously guys want the simple/cheap route and I get that.
But I will tell you right now, Mach guys should read my first POST again. Mach ramps are a total fail IMO aimed at LC.
880s work really well, especially down low.... but will still need other items(spring or helix) to get an Ultimax to rev high enough. I have preferred the Ultimax for many yrs for its ultra clean nature and no slippage and longevity. And it's the correct size for the Mach, stock belts are too long IMO.
Helix is one of the issues, been saying this since day one. Too steep! Turbos will slip the belt with these stock angles.
BTW I posted a new video last night for secondary disassembly ect...will not bother posting it here as the site seems to have gone to the dogs. I make these videos with guys who have not worked on their own sleds in mind, and can use some help.
Those of you who know everything already and there are plenty here, please spare me your thoughts, i'm good.
Just look up rockerdan on youtube.
Dan
But I will tell you right now, Mach guys should read my first POST again. Mach ramps are a total fail IMO aimed at LC.
880s work really well, especially down low.... but will still need other items(spring or helix) to get an Ultimax to rev high enough. I have preferred the Ultimax for many yrs for its ultra clean nature and no slippage and longevity. And it's the correct size for the Mach, stock belts are too long IMO.
Helix is one of the issues, been saying this since day one. Too steep! Turbos will slip the belt with these stock angles.
BTW I posted a new video last night for secondary disassembly ect...will not bother posting it here as the site seems to have gone to the dogs. I make these videos with guys who have not worked on their own sleds in mind, and can use some help.
Those of you who know everything already and there are plenty here, please spare me your thoughts, i'm good.
Just look up rockerdan on youtube.
Dan
Power
These sleds came with less boost then advertised. 17.4PSI in the technical video was a huge part of why most of us thought these sleds would be in the 205hp range. In the end, these sleds are near 16psi. Had a long conversation last week with(Unamed) and after he checked boost on several 900r's, they all seem to be around that 16psi at most. Also said that the test mules of last spring, which many magazine writers rode, were MUCH MUCH stronger then these production sleds. IMO this is likely why the stock 897 Mach ramps do not work well, and especially on a fresh sled which takes many miles to loosen up. Notice I didnt say "break in". IMO there is no break in built into the ECU program, and tuners who have been able to read the ECU also agree.
So with this being said.....riding these sleds with stock tune, "is what it is". I personally want a lot more! hearing really good feedback on the Hurricane ECU and will be talking with Dave by next season. I will likely leave things stock this year and see if other tuners will bring anything out.
Mach Z overall appeal
Aside from the power, the Mach Z (in particular) is an incredible sled overall. The Smart Shox really need to be talked about more, with the trail miles now piling up and getting to ride some groomed, some pounded, some high speed sweepers and of course lakes....I'm amazed how composed the SS system makes the sled feel. I swap often with Dano(adr) and while the Adr. feels surprisingly good, the base shocks have their limits and so he must crank up his torsions more, resulting in some kickback on the bigger hits. With my modded transfer setup I have the sled feeling MUCH more playful, and have been really getting the feel of how the SS system plays into transfer once you mod it. Softest SS setting will result in the best transfer, rather obvious....but WOW this really changes things alot more then even I had assumed. So not only can you change your firmness with button instantly, you will also change your transfer instantly too. Slick!!!
Another side effect of firmest mode I love is we finally got onto some big sweepers and man the firm mode feels like you added a 50mm anti-sway bar instantly with a switch of the mode button, just incredible how FLAT this sled will sit on biggest high speed turns, and also even slower tighter corners the sled will no longer "dive" on the outer shock. Back to soft for big wide open rollers where you want that front to blip the nose off the knolls, transfer mod and soft settings have this sled feeling super playful and much lighter then it is on paper. Where my Winder would wear me out in big moguls, the Mach keeps me feeling fresh, this 137" chassie with SS works incredible!
When it comes to clutching, it really will come down to your belt choice. I have found the 44/38 helix to be the biggest change that I like. Slippage in very top end is something I fought on the Winder too, 38 helps with this. As mentioned many times, the 897's are not what I liked at all. 880s work really well with 44/38 helix. And as always I will say again, many ways to clutch to get similar end results. Things that I tested and DO NOT WORK WELL are higher start secondary spring, they do very little in mid and hurt top end. Also if running Dalton adj you can mimic the 880 with tip weight. 880's are heavy at 85.5g however what people need to realize is most of the concentration is in the heel. So it acts like a lighter weight then the 897 as it has a lightened tip already.
Dan
These sleds came with less boost then advertised. 17.4PSI in the technical video was a huge part of why most of us thought these sleds would be in the 205hp range. In the end, these sleds are near 16psi. Had a long conversation last week with(Unamed) and after he checked boost on several 900r's, they all seem to be around that 16psi at most. Also said that the test mules of last spring, which many magazine writers rode, were MUCH MUCH stronger then these production sleds. IMO this is likely why the stock 897 Mach ramps do not work well, and especially on a fresh sled which takes many miles to loosen up. Notice I didnt say "break in". IMO there is no break in built into the ECU program, and tuners who have been able to read the ECU also agree.
So with this being said.....riding these sleds with stock tune, "is what it is". I personally want a lot more! hearing really good feedback on the Hurricane ECU and will be talking with Dave by next season. I will likely leave things stock this year and see if other tuners will bring anything out.
Mach Z overall appeal
Aside from the power, the Mach Z (in particular) is an incredible sled overall. The Smart Shox really need to be talked about more, with the trail miles now piling up and getting to ride some groomed, some pounded, some high speed sweepers and of course lakes....I'm amazed how composed the SS system makes the sled feel. I swap often with Dano(adr) and while the Adr. feels surprisingly good, the base shocks have their limits and so he must crank up his torsions more, resulting in some kickback on the bigger hits. With my modded transfer setup I have the sled feeling MUCH more playful, and have been really getting the feel of how the SS system plays into transfer once you mod it. Softest SS setting will result in the best transfer, rather obvious....but WOW this really changes things alot more then even I had assumed. So not only can you change your firmness with button instantly, you will also change your transfer instantly too. Slick!!!
Another side effect of firmest mode I love is we finally got onto some big sweepers and man the firm mode feels like you added a 50mm anti-sway bar instantly with a switch of the mode button, just incredible how FLAT this sled will sit on biggest high speed turns, and also even slower tighter corners the sled will no longer "dive" on the outer shock. Back to soft for big wide open rollers where you want that front to blip the nose off the knolls, transfer mod and soft settings have this sled feeling super playful and much lighter then it is on paper. Where my Winder would wear me out in big moguls, the Mach keeps me feeling fresh, this 137" chassie with SS works incredible!
When it comes to clutching, it really will come down to your belt choice. I have found the 44/38 helix to be the biggest change that I like. Slippage in very top end is something I fought on the Winder too, 38 helps with this. As mentioned many times, the 897's are not what I liked at all. 880s work really well with 44/38 helix. And as always I will say again, many ways to clutch to get similar end results. Things that I tested and DO NOT WORK WELL are higher start secondary spring, they do very little in mid and hurt top end. Also if running Dalton adj you can mimic the 880 with tip weight. 880's are heavy at 85.5g however what people need to realize is most of the concentration is in the heel. So it acts like a lighter weight then the 897 as it has a lightened tip already.
Dan
61 - 69 of 69 Posts
