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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Are there instructions on how to get at the primer of older sleds anywhere?

I have a 94 Mach Z and a 93 Formula Mach 1. The most difficult part is figuring out how to get at the back of the primer to remove and replace it. I'd appreciate any instructions, videos, or links anyone could share about this.

Thank you.
 

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Agree with Paul, there will be a retaining nut on either the front or back that you'll need to thread off.
Yeah and then don't remove the hoses from it put new on the new primer infact get it all set up with new hose before you remove the old then install new.
 

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Correct, remove two small fuel lines with needle nose (note which one goes on the pressure and suction side, and a finger tight plastic nut with metal retainer (carful not to drop that little metal retainer). She should pull right out then.
 
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thank you for all the help. My concern is that there is no obvious way to get at the back of the primer so I can remove it. Please see the three pictures via the links below. This is the 93 Formula Mach 1. If anyone could help with instructions on what I need to remove so I can get to the back of the primer and work on it that would be helpful. Or is it a matter of working blindly by reaching in with my hand to hopefully get to it? If there is a service manual online that someone could refer me to, that would be helpful also.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9hUUIUP5FiDbmR0eVBZTDJGLW8/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9hUUIUP5FiDSUV2cE5jZmVWanM/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9hUUIUP5FiDWUtVSF9VTktId1E/view?usp=sharing
 

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You may need to remove your oil reservoir.

You might be able to loosen the nut by holding it with your finger while turning the primer from the outside. It would take a couple of turns and re-turns (meaning, un-twist the tubes).

Then you might be able to pull the primer and have enough tubes to feed them through the hole and connect them.

I am curious of why there are two shutoff valves.
 

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Agree, loosen the oil tank to see of you can get your hand back there to see what going on. All primers I have seen have a plastic retaining nut that you remove then pull the primer out. You need access in the back to route the new lines and also to loosen the primer. Also to remember - make sure the line you use is rated for winter! Not all line is the same, it has to be rated for cold temps or it cracks. Tygon is the best out there and you can get on line.
 

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Looks like a standard primer with the retaining nut on the inside of the engine compartment. I hear you about working blind; take a flat screwdriver and lightly tap the nut to loosen it......it you can't get your hand or wrench near it as a result of the tight space.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks everyone for the help! I'm going to give it a try this weekend when I'm up there with the sleds.

Are there any service manuals for these sleds?

I'd love to see some instructions on how to remove the oil reservoir to get at the primer. I can try to wing it of course, but I won't have a lot of time when I'm up there this weekend and it would be nice to have access to a service manual with directions. Maybe I'll have time to ride them as well :)
 

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Not really. Not sure what it would shut off besides oil. Hate to forget that one if it is. At least fuel shutoff will remind you in about 60 seconds after starting it up and the only harm is when you face-palm yourself.

I'd trace the lines and see where they go.
 

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Those are fuel shutoff valves and prevent fuel from the tank going to carbs. Close these after every ride and especially if trailering because otherwise all the fuel in your tank is being held back by the carb needle and seats ( and if they leak, you'll have an engine full of fuel).

Regarding primer, should be no need to remove oil tank. It is a tight fit but can be done with some capable finger work and needle nose to remove the two primer lines (suction and pressure).
 
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I am curious of why there are two shutoff valves.
The '93 M1 has two fuel pumps, hence two shut of valves.

Not really. Not sure what it would shut off besides oil. Hate to forget that one if it is. At least fuel shutoff will remind you in about 60 seconds after starting it up and the only harm is when you face-palm yourself.

I'd trace the lines and see where they go.
Now, why would anyone ever shut off oil delivery??
 

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Yup. 2 fuel lines from the tank, 2 pumps. It appears each pump feeds both carbs. Redundant like an airplane.

Thanks everyone for the help! I'm going to give it a try this weekend when I'm up there with the sleds.

Are there any service manuals for these sleds?

I'd love to see some instructions on how to remove the oil reservoir to get at the primer. I can try to wing it of course, but I won't have a lot of time when I'm up there this weekend and it would be nice to have access to a service manual with directions. Maybe I'll have time to ride them as well :)
I have a 90-95 manual. PM your email and I'll send it to you. Doubt it will help in this situation however.
 
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Oh yeah, why do you want to remove the primer? I suspect because it's dry and doesn't work, correct?

If that is the case, try disconnecting the feed line at the main fuel line connections and fill that feed line with engine foam. The stuff you use to summerize the motor. I have to do this with my 95 every year. Works like new every time and lasts all winter.
 
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Just regular 2 stroke oil will work as well. When I summarize, I put just a little 2 stroke oil in the primer. Works perfect every fall.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Wow. That would save me a lot of work. My primer is not working after a few years of sitting. That's why I'm thinking I need to replace it.

Please take a look at this short video so you can see the symptom:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9hUUIUP5FiDTEVJam1wdHplb0k/view?usp=sharing

As you can see, the primer acts as if it was on a spring. When I pull on it, it goes right back in without me pushing it. I've got 4 sleds which sat for a few years and they all act the same way. Do you think some 2-stroke oil or engine foam will fix that? Or is it too late?

Can you clarify exactly where I should insert the oil or foam? There are two hoses attached to the primer. One goes to the carburetor and the other one I suppose goes to the gas tank. Do I disconnect the hose right at the gas tank if I can reach it? (not at the connection with the primer, right?). Then how do I insert the oil or foam into the hose? LIke with a turkey baster? do does it need to be sucked in with the primer? How much oil to I put in? Enough fill the whole fuel hose from the end all the way to the primer?

Thanks again for all your help!
 

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insert the oil into the input side of the primer. Chances are, your check valve is stuck. When it pulls back, that is a good sign because it means the O-ring is in good shape.

You might need to force it in. The way I do is is with a short piece of hose. Fill the hose up with oil, connect it to the input side, and blow into the hose.
 

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Watching your video, the first thing you should try is just pressurizing the gas tank. It will force fuel through the lines and get gas closer to the primer.

The problem you're going to have getting the primer primed is the fact that the hoses are all buried under the oil and coolant reservoirs.

I did a write up on primers a while back with pictures. Primer is nothing more than a plunger with an O-Ring for the seal. Then two check valves, one in, one out. Little steel balls is all they are, some times they get stuck.

So if the plunger is pulling itself back in, that means the input side is not opening up.

Here is what I do: Pressurize the tank with about 3-8 PSI. Watch the fuel flow through the lines for about 20 seconds. Then pull the plunger out and hold it out until it does not want to pull back in. Then push in really quick and slowly pull back out. If you can see the primer lines, you can watch fuel getting sucked into the line. Repeat the process until plunger is squishy again.
 
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