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boost junkie
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the R turbo can run more rpms than the old turbo could
those extra mm make a big difference in both boost and exhaust flow
 
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Discussion Starter · #104 ·
Dynotech on average is about 7% higher than what any other dyno reads that I have seen. Take off 7% from their peak numbers and you should have an accurate power number.
I have to disagree, I have owned a superflow dyno for 20 years and have been using all brands for 40 years.
Superflow is the most accurate dyno made, they have a built in weather station that monitors Barometric pressure, Temperature, and Humidity and its not adjustable.
The superflow uses a Strain gauge that measure torque at the source and is calibrated by hanging calibration weights off the dyno and checking them very 100 lbs up to 500 lbs.
STD Correction factor is used to correct back to a standard day set by the Society of Automotive Engineers in this case for our Region is 60F degrees, Dry air, 29.92 Barometric pressure.
That means if it's colder than 60F degrees the dyno is correcting the numbers down from measured.
If hotter than 60F correcting the numbers up from Measured.
Given the date on the dyno sheet I am confident in stating the dyno was correcting down from measured Tq and Hp.
I have been to Jims dyno and Know first hand the Meticulous steps he takes in collecting accurate data, he has no skin in the game, he is totally independent, and unbias.
I hope this helps.
Ted.
 

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Yup wrestling is real football is fake and 190 hp only buys you about 108 mph on a good day.....
Like others have said. It must be a sensor. I upgraded the intercooler and mid pipe and still had the low rpm issue. It got better with more miles. More upgrades for next year. Time to get rid of the factory ecu (which I think is the problem) and get a MoTeC.
 

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I have to disagree, I have owned a superflow dyno for 20 years and have been using all brands for 40 years.
Superflow is the most accurate dyno made, they have a built in weather station that monitors Barometric pressure, Temperature, and Humidity and its not adjustable.
The superflow uses a Strain gauge that measure torque at the source and is calibrated by hanging calibration weights off the dyno and checking them very 100 lbs up to 500 lbs.
STD Correction factor is used to correct back to a standard day set by the Society of Automotive Engineers in this case for our Region is 60F degrees, Dry air, 29.92 Barometric pressure.
That means if it's colder than 60F degrees the dyno is correcting the numbers down from measured.
If hotter than 60F correcting the numbers up from Measured.
Given the date on the dyno sheet I am confident in stating the dyno was correcting down from measured Tq and Hp.
I have been to Jims dyno and Know first hand the Meticulous steps he takes in collecting accurate data, he has no skin in the game, he is totally independent, and unbias.
I hope this helps.
Ted.
I had to let this sit for a bit before replying as I don't need to start yet another debate with you. Ted or Curtis whomever is posting you really need to take some time and educate yourself further on Dynotech, as well as the snowmobile industry as a whole. Along with that it maybe better to sit on the sidelines and learn more about this platform and others before jumping in with suggestions. It has been common for YEARS for everyone to go to dynotech for "the number" to both sell product and dyno sleds for showing off power. Take any engine that is run there and run it on another dyno and it will always be 7% - 8 % off. Now either everyone else is reading low or there is one that just reads high. ALL the aftermarket guys use their dyno to sell product because it shows well. There is no sense in arguing over this do your own research. However should anyone spend the time to do a little research, call some other shops, and check some other dyno runs out and you will see. The boost / hp tables on the Dynotech run should be all you need to see what I am talking about...if they made the hp Dynotech claims they wouldn't struggle to run 110 mph :D
 

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I have to disagree, I have owned a superflow dyno for 20 years and have been using all brands for 40 years.

Superflow is the most accurate dyno made, they have a built in weather station that monitors Barometric pressure, Temperature, and Humidity and its not adjustable.

The superflow uses a Strain gauge that measure torque at the source and is calibrated by hanging calibration weights off the dyno and checking them very 100 lbs up to 500 lbs.

STD Correction factor is used to correct back to a standard day set by the Society of Automotive Engineers in this case for our Region is 60F degrees, Dry air, 29.92 Barometric pressure.

That means if it's colder than 60F degrees the dyno is correcting the numbers down from measured.

If hotter than 60F correcting the numbers up from Measured.
Given the date on the dyno sheet I am confident in stating the dyno was correcting down from measured Tq and Hp.

I have been to Jims dyno and Know first hand the Meticulous steps he takes in collecting accurate data, he has no skin in the game, he is totally independent, and unbias.

I hope this helps.

Ted.
On the dyno thing it has been mentioned for years and I have done my dyno research, and I too have taken a special trip to DynoTech which I made with my father. In fact the other dyno facilities are the ones who helped provide a better understanding of the disparity, but the current thinking has proved to have a layer of enamel that could not be pierced. It is essentially the reason that Jim and many others no longer posts on DooTalk, and I assume you will eventually quit for the same reason as all the others. Somewhere I have the link to the latest guy who provided some kind of DooTalk resignation letter which I found it awful to read.

I am writing this reply to you because I have become discouraged with the loss. My hope is that you can take a longer view of DooTalk versus the shorter one that is destined to find trouble. Do me a favour by avoiding to reply to those who give you trouble, and keep participating.
 

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On the dyno thing it has been mentioned for years and I have done my dyno research, and I too have taken a special trip to DynoTech which I made with my father. In fact the other dyno facilities are the ones who helped provide a better understanding of the disparity, but the current thinking has proved to have a layer of enamel that could not be pierced. It is essentially the reason that Jim and many others no longer posts on DooTalk, and I assume you will eventually quit for the same reason as all the others. Somewhere I have the link to the latest guy who provided some kind of DooTalk resignation letter which I found it awful to read.

I am writing this reply to you because I have become discouraged with the loss. My hope is that you can take a longer view of DooTalk versus the shorter one that is destined to find trouble. Do me a favour by avoiding to reply to those who give you trouble, and keep participating.
Daag no offense but debating the validity of dyno runs hardly necessitates someone leaving a website unless of course they have thin skin and cannot handle being questioned. Seems to be the common liberal thinking or cancel culture. Don't like my opinion better cancel that guy, ignore him or delete the posts. It's laughable to say the least. Agree with me or not there are MANY who do. So while some can appreciate your opinion it's just that your opinion. Same as there is mine it doesn't take a rocket scientist to compare data, and it really doesn't take a rocket scientist to know the 900R doesn't make 190+ hp at 14 psi boost...
 

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You are right, to a degree. Early on more than a couple guys said reset the TPS, another bunch said that wasn't the issue. Now BRP says do it people are heading back to the dealer to get it done.

These forums are great - if you're willing to listen and learn. Unfortunately there are still those who flatly refuse to listen to some who offer help because they don't trust the message, or the messenger.
When they run at 8000 RPM, Mach z 2022 and all other 900T R are the fastest from 0-60 and 0-100mph but not the fastest for top speed for stock snowmobile.
If you want to be the fastest 0-60 and the fastest for top speed,(with the same gearing) you will have to increase the RPM and at the same time the HP. To do that you will have to modify the ECU. Impossible for the moment and if done, you are no more stock.
You can also change the gearing (go from 25/47 to 26/47) and you will be probably the fastest for top speed but not for 0-100 .(and you are no more stock).
As for the BRP update ,I have a renegade X 900T R that was ok (8000 rpm) at beginning of season and rapidly got bad to 7500rpm. During season and before the update ,i change the primary spring to 150/350(skidoo spring) from 170/300 .It helps but did not went back to 8000. So went to the dealer and ask him to check the wire and reset the tps. The wire was loose (may be 1/2in) now it is like a guitar cord and i am back to 8000rpm.
So the BRP update ( diference with me it is just the spring 170/400) will be helpful but do not expect an increase for top speed if you have already a good running 900T R at 8000RPM .
 

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^^^ Last sentence, if you have a good running one there really isn't a need to do the update, and that's pretty much what BRP said too.
 

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Discussion Starter · #113 ·
I had to let this sit for a bit before replying as I don't need to start yet another debate with you. Ted or Curtis whomever is posting you really need to take some time and educate yourself further on Dynotech, as well as the snowmobile industry as a whole. Along with that it maybe better to sit on the sidelines and learn more about this platform and others before jumping in with suggestions. It has been common for YEARS for everyone to go to dynotech for "the number" to both sell product and dyno sleds for showing off power. Take any engine that is run there and run it on another dyno and it will always be 7% - 8 % off. Now either everyone else is reading low or there is one that just reads high. ALL the aftermarket guys use their dyno to sell product because it shows well. There is no sense in arguing over this do your own research. However should anyone spend the time to do a little research, call some other shops, and check some other dyno runs out and you will see. The boost / hp tables on the Dynotech run should be all you need to see what I am talking about...if they made the hp Dynotech claims they wouldn't struggle to run 110 mph :D
Awe come on Jamie I enjoy our little chats.
Who the hell is Curtis?
FYI a lot of dyno companies choose to use SAE correction factor, Air temp 77 deg F (25 deg C), 29.235 Inches- Hg (990 mb) altitude-corrected barometric pressure, 0 ft ( 0 m) altitude, 0% relative humidity.
Note the difference from STD.
If a dyno corrects to a higher temp and lower Baro the numbers will be lower, then neither takes in to account Humidity which can swing the numbers a little with no correction for that.
So you are right in saying other dynos read lower.
Have a wonderful day.

Ted.
 

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Daag no offense but debating the validity of dyno runs hardly necessitates someone leaving a website unless of course they have thin skin and cannot handle being questioned. Seems to be the common liberal thinking or cancel culture. Don't like my opinion better cancel that guy, ignore him or delete the posts. It's laughable to say the least. Agree with me or not there are MANY who do. So while some can appreciate your opinion it's just that your opinion. Same as there is mine it doesn't take a rocket scientist to compare data, and it really doesn't take a rocket scientist to know the 900R doesn't make 190+ hp at 14 psi boost...
I find you take on sleds to be extraordinarily good, and this is the reason that follow. When I saw you were not getting the support needed for the turbo tune, I kept thinking it was a serious problem. I think there is a similar problem between dyno shops that I hope could support each other to work through the variances they see among each other. Unfortunately the tit for tat practice is still too present in our world.

I believe the OEMs are the ones that should be promoting the independent dyno shops to work together to set their own standard, and in turn promote their help to work through the underpowered consumer sleds. On the later, this is something that you have personally taken upon yourself to do over the years, so why are those in the professional world not doing the same???

Another thing to consider is the number of people who own the BUDS 2 system in 2022 compared to only a year or two ago. How can we be so far better equipped with BUDS, TD gauges, GPS phone apps, and yet we are seeing far worse results than in the first year Mach Z twin 17 years ago for MY 2005???
 

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Great stuff.

You can listen to who you chose, one whose career is writing programming for engine builders, or one whose carreer is spending money and posting on here all day every day forever.

Easy pick.

The 05 twin of 17 years ago is faster, no question. Shameful.

The update wont change that, it will just bring the sleds in for a look.....smart owners will talk to their dealers and ask for a status after first look over and plug in, to see if something is found before agreeing to the one and only part change offered.
 

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Great stuff.

You can listen to who you chose, one whose career is writing programming for engine builders, or one whose carreer is spending money and posting on here all day every day forever.

Easy pick.

The 05 twin of 17 years ago is faster, no question. Shameful.

The update wont change that, it will just bring the sleds in for a look.....smart owners will talk to their dealers and ask for a status after first look over and plug in, to see if something is found before agreeing to the one and only part change offered.
You win post of the year award....Good post....
 

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Great stuff.

You can listen to who you chose, one whose career is writing programming for engine builders, or one whose carreer is spending money and posting on here all day every day forever.

Easy pick.

The 05 twin of 17 years ago is faster, no question. Shameful.

The update wont change that, it will just bring the sleds in for a look.....smart owners will talk to their dealers and ask for a status after first look over and plug in, to see if something is found before agreeing to the one and only part change offered.
Wouldn't someone spending money on all the goodies the Dootalkers are interested in and posting their real world DATA LOGGED results from said gimmicks for FREE make sense or is it just me? Seems like a WIN / WIN for the consumer. Only those looking to sell snake oil should be worried ;)
 

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Personally I want to hear it all!
More sources of information is always good - how you filter and use that information is up to each individual.
 

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Body work , comfort , tippiness...and fixes to make it trailable ...its all starting with the gen4 being more of a mountain sled body.......Anybody that rode early 2000 era sleds @ about 140-160hp knows why the newer sled wont mph....I mean theres absolutly nothing magic nor any mystery lol....it has no purpose unless you use the same dyno the same day ,,,it is a tuning tool shouldnt be used as a salesman pitch thats it...
 
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