168 replies to this topic

[Jeb©]

I am still hoping someone post experience with the GBoost on a sled with stock clutching.  I do know some of the guys that work with clutching a lot have a pretty good idea how they would perform with stock clutching but I still would love to hear actual experience if anyone out there has any, Thanks

I would like to help someone tune one in with stock clutching. Good candidate would be anyone who needs clicker 4 to pull proper rpm with a 571 and has the ability to adjust pivot weight. 

[cmracer]

Ran my 21 BCX XRS with 1.6 track & 571 Belt.. Geared it up 2 teeth and stock clutching ... had to drop 1 gram on pivot bolt weight and stay a # 4 to have correct RPM with the 571.

 

Put the GBoost  WBB-383 snow  belt on and ran for 400 miles on the weekend... At first it was over revving so dropped to #3 initial over  rev was gone but peak rpm was down.

 

Had to go back to #4.

 

I believe just adding a little pivot bolt weight and staying at #4 it will be perfect.

 

Other than that its almost identical to 571.

 

I'm  actually leaving it without adding pivot bolt weight... Works well in the deeper snow this way.

Edited by cmracer, 24 February 2021 - 09:43 AM.

[MX-Z Man]

I would like to help someone tune one in with stock clutching. Good candidate would be anyone who needs clicker 4 to pull proper rpm with a 571 and has the ability to adjust pivot weight.

If you need to tune it then its no longer stock, right???

All kinds if info on where you and others have tuned with the belt. I took it as him asking about how it works on a stock set up. Stock as in not changing a thing.

[Jeb©]

If you need to tune it then its no longer stock, right???

All kinds if info on where you and others have tuned with the belt. I took it as him asking about how it works on a stock set up. Stock as in not changing a thing.

So your not allowed to change clickers or pivot with stock belt or xs 821? Why have tuning features if your not allowed to use them? The clickers come stock on the sled, the pivot bolts come stock on the sled. Sounds stock to me. Example, when my 21 had stock clutching and I added xs 821, it only revved to 7700, I am supposed to run it there and say that belt wont work vs using the clicker adjustment to 4 and having it perfect?

If someone believes in just putting something on, falling in a 500rpm range, not using built in adjustments to optimize performance my threads are probably not for them. I will try to help anyone that wants it, I have been very clear about the characteristic's of these belts compared to others, anyone that goes back and reads should know what to expect, for some it may be deeper than their understanding and they should probably just hop on and ride. What ever makes them happy.

Edited by Jeb©, 24 February 2021 - 01:14 PM.

[Couch1]

so your not allowed to change clickers or pivot with stock belt or xs 821? Why have tuning features if your not allowed to use them?

Good question. Lol. Make sure no belt changing either. Lol

[MX-Z Man]

So your not allowed to change clickers or pivot with stock belt or xs 821? Why have tuning features if your not allowed to use them? The clickers come stock on the sled, the pivot bolts come stock on the sled. Sounds stock to me. Example, when my 21 had stock clutching and I added xs 821, it only revved to 7700, I am supposed to run it there and say that belt wont work vs using the clicker adjustment to 4 and having it perfect?
If someone believes in just putting something on, falling in a 500rpm range, not using built in adjustments to optimize performance my threads are probably not for them. I will try to help anyone that wants it, I have been very clear about the characteristic's of these belts compared to others, anyone that goes back and reads should know what to expect, for some it may be deeper than their understanding and they should probably just hop on and ride. What ever makes them happy.

I noted that, you have been very clear with what you have done and what has and hasn't worked. As to what 670hoth was asking about, the way I read it, he wanted to keep it stock. a clicker change, sure. Pivot bolt change now means buying parts and changing them. To you and many other guys that's as common as putting gas in. For others thats something they may not comfortable with.

Thats all. No worries either way.

[djm]

If you need to tune it then its no longer stock, right???

All kinds if info on where you and others have tuned with the belt. I took it as him asking about how it works on a stock set up. Stock as in not changing a thing.

 

No, stock is what's allowed in a stock race class.. Clutch tuning is stock.  Ha ha..  And changing pivot bolts or adding washers is often done between rounds.  Takes no time at all, just pull the clutch guard and get busy with your T handle wrench. 

 

Learning a bit about clutching and doing, makes for a more enjoyable sledding experience... and it doesn't hurt ones shoulder like not having rack steering on a moguled trail.   Just say, it is so easy to do. And so fun to learn.  

 

And I know it is not you we are talking to but 670hoth.  

Edited by djm, 24 February 2021 - 04:09 PM.

[670hoth]

If you need to tune it then its no longer stock, right???

All kinds if info on where you and others have tuned with the belt. I took it as him asking about how it works on a stock set up. Stock as in not changing a thing.

 

 

So your not allowed to change clickers or pivot with stock belt or xs 821? Why have tuning features if your not allowed to use them? The clickers come stock on the sled, the pivot bolts come stock on the sled. Sounds stock to me. Example, when my 21 had stock clutching and I added xs 821, it only revved to 7700, I am supposed to run it there and say that belt wont work vs using the clicker adjustment to 4 and having it perfect?

If someone believes in just putting something on, falling in a 500rpm range, not using built in adjustments to optimize performance my threads are probably not for them. I will try to help anyone that wants it, I have been very clear about the characteristic's of these belts compared to others, anyone that goes back and reads should know what to expect, for some it may be deeper than their understanding and they should probably just hop on and ride. What ever makes them happy.

 

Honestly, I guess I meant just clicker adjustments as MX-Z Man said but maybe I do need to rethink this. I have played around with clutch tuning a lot on past sleds with TRA clutches so I do have a decent understanding of some of it. My thoughts on my current sled, a 2018 850 TNT, is to just run it 'stock'.  As far as the clickers go, it seems many people are not happy with overall performance on clicker position 4 when they are forced to run it to achieve the correct top RPM.  In a nutshell, my sled has a 531 with about 1000 miles on it. The sled has about 4000 and has never blown a belt. Regardless, I am worried about blowing the 531 and causing carnage if I play too hard on the lake so I never hold it very long. I want to buy a new belt and was leaning toward an XS821 but hear mixed comments about whether is may improve or degrade performance over the 531. The 571 is out after all of the inconsistent performance and dropping rpm that I hear about. I definitely do not want to take even a small performance hit since I ride with some Pol 850s and a 900T and don't want to get beat when we line up on the lake which will probably happen soon. I guess I am not opposed to doing something with pivot bolts or washers.  My only issue is I don't have a convenient local place to have a good test and tune session. It would be more like put the belt on and run it for a day including mostly trail but some lake time and then make a change at home before the next ride.  I can take the time to stop and change clickers during the ride if I am with the group but that's about it. If you think the GBoost belt will be close enough that  I could get it working good without a lot of time I would not mind giving it a try.  Please let me know what you think.  My sled has the 129" Ripsaw 1.25" with 90ish picks and the stock gearing.  I did update it with the doo clutch cooling kit like they put on the 2019s and up as a preventive measure. I am not totally opposed to a gear change either if it will help me with the Pol 850s and 900T on top end.  I hear the Doo 850 is not great on top end compared to these sleds.  Thanks

[Wink1]

That’s a great thing about adjustable pin weights, you can change them almost as fast as changing clickers. Just keep a T-handle Allen wrench in your glove box. Takes about a gram to a gram and a half to change 100 rpm.

[Donseye]

If you need to tune it then its no longer stock, right???

All kinds if info on where you and others have tuned with the belt. I took it as him asking about how it works on a stock set up. Stock as in not changing a thing.

I have a good friend that installed a GBoost belt on a 2020 TNT and all he did was put clickers in 2 and now has 600 miles on it. It runs 7900-8000 all the time. When he goes out to the lake for some fun drag racing he can beat all of the 850's pretty easy. Unless of course there is an 850 in the bunch that has some extra's and a lot of tuning.    Now that is no different then the folks with the 821.....they should go to clicker 4 or they need to re-clutch for optimal performance.

[Jeb©]

Honestly, I guess I meant just clicker adjustments as MX-Z Man said but maybe I do need to rethink this. I have played around with clutch tuning a lot on past sleds with TRA clutches so I do have a decent understanding of some of it. My thoughts on my current sled, a 2018 850 TNT, is to just run it 'stock'.  As far as the clickers go, it seems many people are not happy with overall performance on clicker position 4 when they are forced to run it to achieve the correct top RPM.  In a nutshell, my sled has a 531 with about 1000 miles on it. The sled has about 4000 and has never blown a belt. Regardless, I am worried about blowing the 531 and causing carnage if I play too hard on the lake so I never hold it very long. I want to buy a new belt and was leaning toward an XS821 but hear mixed comments about whether is may improve or degrade performance over the 531. The 571 is out after all of the inconsistent performance and dropping rpm that I hear about. I definitely do not want to take even a small performance hit since I ride with some Pol 850s and a 900T and don't want to get beat when we line up on the lake which will probably happen soon. I guess I am not opposed to doing something with pivot bolts or washers.  My only issue is I don't have a convenient local place to have a good test and tune session. It would be more like put the belt on and run it for a day including mostly trail but some lake time and then make a change at home before the next ride.  I can take the time to stop and change clickers during the ride if I am with the group but that's about it. If you think the GBoost belt will be close enough that  I could get it working good without a lot of time I would not mind giving it a try.  Please let me know what you think.  My sled has the 129" Ripsaw 1.25" with 90ish picks and the stock gearing.  I did update it with the doo clutch cooling kit like they put on the 2019s and up as a preventive measure. I am not totally opposed to a gear change either if it will help me with the Pol 850s and 900T on top end.  I hear the Doo 850 is not great on top end compared to these sleds.  Thanks

If you don't blow belts and you are on clicker 3 with 531, you are happy with your rpms and performance, buy another 531. You stated you dont want to mess with pivot and not sure what performance will change if you adjust clickers....I would keep doing what you are doing. My first reply to your question was, the gboost would be a good candidate for someone pulling low rpms on clicker 3 or needing clicker 4 with a 571. That scenario would allow a gboost to be added and run perfect rpms on clicker 3. I also agree, if your rpms are good with 531 on 3, an 821 is not a good choice as you would need to click to 4 to maintain rpms. I have data logged that scenario with an 821, it is slower ET  than clicker 3. For someone that does not care, just wants peak rpms close, no problem. You stated you wanted best results when you do line up against some polaris 850's and you dont have the ability to test or compare anything, my advice would be stick with a belt that gets you 79-8000 peak rpms in clicker 3.

There is a reasonable chance you could put a new gboost on, click to 2 when new and rpms would be right on and you would be a rocket, after 3-500 miles may need to click back to 3. I think that would happen but have not tested it.

Edited by Jeb©, 25 February 2021 - 08:58 AM.

[djm]

If you don't blow belts and you are on clicker 3 with 531, you are happy with your rpms and performance, buy another 531. You stated you dont want to mess with pivot and not sure what performance will change if you adjust clickers....I would keep doing what you are doing. My first reply to your question was, the gboost would be a good candidate for someone pulling low rpms on clicker 3 or needing clicker 4 with a 571. That scenario would allow a gboost to be added and run perfect rpms on clicker 3. I also agree, if your rpms are good with 531 on 3, an 821 is not a good choice as you would need to click to 4 to maintain rpms. I have data logged that scenario with an 821, it is slower ET  than clicker 3. For someone that does not care, just wants peak rpms close, no problem. You stated you wanted best results when you do line up against some polaris 850's and you dont have the ability to test or compare anything, my advice would be stick with a belt that gets you 79-8000 peak rpms in clicker 3.

There is a reasonable chance you could put a new gboost on, click to 2 when new and rpms would be right on and you would be a rocket, after 3-500 miles may need to click back to 3. I think that would happen but have not tested it.

 

So if he put a Gboost belt on and he wanted to leave it in clicker 3; just pull out his stock 33 mm bolts 15.2g's and screw in 38 mm 16.7g bolts .. 1.5 g add.  maybe have to add a 1 gram washer.   Or he could just use two gram washers with his 33 mm stock pivot bolts?    no major clutch changes.   And when he lake races he wants to be about 7800 to 7850 on his tach depending on how it reads maybe drop to clicker 2 from 3.  

[Jeb©]

So if he put a Gboost belt on and he wanted to leave it in clicker 3; just pull out his stock 33 mm bolts 15.2g's and screw in 38 mm 16.7g bolts .. 1.5 g add.  maybe have to add a 1 gram washer.   Or he could just use two gram washers with his 33 mm stock pivot bolts?    no major clutch changes.   And when he lake races he wants to be about 7800 to 7850 on his tach depending on how it reads maybe drop to clicker 2 from 3.  

pretty close, A gboost would need at least 3g on the pivot to remain on the same clicker, by 700 miles you would go back to stock pivot. Seat of the pants will fool you, it will feel revvier than a belt that loads harder down low but it will be quicker. I compared many times to fresh 391 go to belt that was always my gold standard, no belt would beat it. logged the runs, would have bet my left n_t that the 391 would win as rpms would feel perfect loading, was always wrong...glad I never bet. Funny thing is if they still made 391's I never would have learned all this.

Edited by Jeb©, 25 February 2021 - 11:47 PM.

[670hoth]

If you don't blow belts and you are on clicker 3 with 531, you are happy with your rpms and performance, buy another 531. You stated you dont want to mess with pivot and not sure what performance will change if you adjust clickers....I would keep doing what you are doing. My first reply to your question was, the gboost would be a good candidate for someone pulling low rpms on clicker 3 or needing clicker 4 with a 571. That scenario would allow a gboost to be added and run perfect rpms on clicker 3. I also agree, if your rpms are good with 531 on 3, an 821 is not a good choice as you would need to click to 4 to maintain rpms. I have data logged that scenario with an 821, it is slower ET  than clicker 3. For someone that does not care, just wants peak rpms close, no problem. You stated you wanted best results when you do line up against some polaris 850's and you dont have the ability to test or compare anything, my advice would be stick with a belt that gets you 79-8000 peak rpms in clicker 3.

There is a reasonable chance you could put a new gboost on, click to 2 when new and rpms would be right on and you would be a rocket, after 3-500 miles may need to click back to 3. I think that would happen but have not tested it.

 

Well, I will buy a GBoost WBB-383 and give it a try.  If I have to do more than clickers to be happy with it I will. I am riding and will probably put on 150 or 200 miles on Saturday but won't be able to get a GBoost belt before then. Right now we have a week of warm weather coming and possibly some rain.  I hope things turn around but since we never ended up getting a good snow base this year there is a chance there may be little to no March riding.  If the 10 day forecast looks ok by Monday or Tuesday I will order the belt.  If it looks bad all the way into mid-March I may just finish out the year with the 531 and get a GBoost to start out next winter.   

[mikmaze]

my ultimax arrive yesterday, headed north with it and it will be my spare belt. wow this thing seems stiff. xs821