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850 Top End Recommendations

rebuild topend pistons

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10 replies to this topic

Poll: What to do for 850 topend (12 member(s) have cast votes)

What'd you pick?

  1. MCB Forged for $460 (2 votes [16.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.67%

  2. OEM for $550 (10 votes [83.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 83.33%

  3. Rings and gaskets for $170 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

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#1 Utah-Doo-Doo

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Posted 02 June 2020 - 10:44 PM

I'm back after a spring jet skiing hiatus.

 

I got a motor on here and the pistons look like they are worn out? Idk. cylinder and pistons have all sorts of carbon build up.

 

The coating on the skirts is almost worn off on the bottom edge. Supposed to be around 2000 mi or km.

 

My pistons on my 3100 mile motor look better except for the scoring, of course.

 

Do I get an:

 

MCB forged topend for $460?

 

100% OEM topend pieced together for about $550+

 

Clean the carbon, put on new rings? $120+50 in gaskets.


Edited by Utah-Doo-Doo, 02 June 2020 - 10:45 PM.


#2 djm

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Posted 03 June 2020 - 07:51 PM

This is a spare 850 engine that you bought from someone here on Dootalk?   Is it still together such that you could run a leak down test and a compression test on the bench?  

 

Is the intent to have a fresh engine sitting on the shelf so that when the current one gets tired, you can just drop in the fresh one?   If this is the case and you  want it to be as fresh as possible, I would just get new Doo 850 pistons and rings, as they have the cast iron insert ala a diesel engine that the ring groove is in, and the big/heavy piston ring rides in the cast iron groove which doesn't get pounded out like a groove in a regular aluminum piston be it forged or cast. Plus with this cast iron insert you are not going to lose the ring anti rotation feature like can happen to an anti rotaion pin pressed into an aluminum piston. 

 

And if you were old and lazy like me, I would box it up and send it to Big John and let him go through it and check it out, do a light hone and assemble it with new Doo pistons and rings.  And while I was at it, would probably have it ported..  Easy for me to spend other people's money.  



#3 Utah-Doo-Doo

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Posted 05 June 2020 - 07:38 PM

no, my 3000 mile burned/melted a rod big end oil feed and locked up.

 

I guess I will just spend the $600 on an OEM topend. 

 

Sucks to be $8100 into a $6000 bluebook sled now.



#4 Daag44

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Posted 05 June 2020 - 11:43 PM

Did BRP help in any way?
 

Oil line caught.... fire? *%@
Started By Utah-Doo-Doo, Apr 04 2020 10:24 PM
 

 


Hey Utah-Doo-Doo, thanks for reaching out. We're sorry to hear of what happened with your unit and really hope no one was hurt. BRP takes safety very seriously and we would like to get an opportunity to find out more about what happened so we can ensure to build even safer vehicles in the future. Please email us to [email protected] with your VIN number, and a reference to this forum, or to your username. We are looking forward to hearing from you. Talk soon, Vanessa-BRPcare

Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R P-TEK Electrical Troubleshooting #1 and #2 
800R Turbo
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#5 Utah-Doo-Doo

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Posted 06 June 2020 - 06:52 PM

Did BRP help in any way?
 

Oil line caught.... fire? *%@
Started By Utah-Doo-Doo, Apr 04 2020 10:24 PM
 

I got sent instructions to fill out their incident form and 2 days later was informed my "case" was closed. So... not really, no.

 

I'm mostly upset that they wont sell rods, where my old motor would have been fine with a new rod and bearing, and some machining on the crank journal, instead of $1800 for a new crank for a $200 rod and bearing....



#6 Alatalo

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Posted 07 June 2020 - 05:41 AM

What the heck...?

 

They made YOU fill out an incident form because of THEIR safety concerns and THEIR will to "build even safer vehicles in the future" (as their initial post said). Only to tell you the case is closed...?

 

That does not sound right. You do realize YOU performed work in order to improve THEIR product, without any kind of reward...?

 

I would try to take that further.



#7 Utah-Doo-Doo

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Posted 07 June 2020 - 12:45 PM

What the heck...?

They made YOU fill out an incident form because of THEIR safety concerns and THEIR will to "build even safer vehicles in the future" (as their initial post said). Only to tell you the case is closed...?

That does not sound right. You do realize YOU performed work in order to improve THEIR product, without any kind of reward...?

I would try to take that further.


Trust me, i wish it would have burned to the ground so I could claim insurance. Nope, just a soot covered engine plate with 1 oil line missing.

Do any sponsors of dootalk drop ship OEM stuff for discount?

#8 Dynamo^Joe

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Posted 10 June 2020 - 12:06 PM

I would do a piston to cylinder wall clearance check first.

Dont worry about the coating so much at this point, its a few microns thick, not a few thousand thick.

From 3/8" inch up from the bottom of the bore, what is the i-diameter.

From 3/8"~7/16" inch up from the bottom of the piston, what is the mic'd o-diameter.

Uhhh...if I remember right, it should be .009 or less.  .010 is replace.   If I remember i'll dbl chk the shop manual, but I think I seen that value.

 

My friend owns a machine shop says a good rule of thumb is to look at the maximum clearance.  Say in this case .009.  Multiply that by .8 and replace at that value, because if you are going to keep the sled into the future for as long as you've had it to this point and have the engine apart. then at (.009 x .8) =.007  change out the piston so you'll have the same piston life span again [wear from .003 to .007] and hopefully by that time of next-wear interval, you're in for buying a new sled.



#9 Daag44

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Posted 10 June 2020 - 04:46 PM

I got sent instructions to fill out their incident form and 2 days later was informed my "case" was closed. So... not really, no.

I'm mostly upset that they wont sell rods, where my old motor would have been fine with a new rod and bearing, and some machining on the crank journal, instead of $1800 for a new crank for a $200 rod and bearing....

 
Fractured rod replacement needing laser alignment is one of the details that was left out of the original welcome to the 850 campaign.
 
Fractured split connecting rods on 850
Started By Roamer7, Apr 13 2019 09:58 AM


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R P-TEK Electrical Troubleshooting #1 and #2 
800R Turbo
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#10 Daag44

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Posted 10 June 2020 - 04:58 PM

There is a bottom end for sale on DooTalk. The owner is currently asking $750 USD.

 

850 bottom end
Started By cgoff1984, Jun 07 2020 06:11 AM


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R P-TEK Electrical Troubleshooting #1 and #2 
800R Turbo
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#11 Daag44

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  • Sled:2007 1000 SDI

Posted 10 June 2020 - 05:02 PM

A new crank is apparently under $1,500 USD.
 
Source for 850 cranks
Started By Gordo427, Today, 09:15 AM
 


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R P-TEK Electrical Troubleshooting #1 and #2 
800R Turbo
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix






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