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Another 800etec down and out.


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#31 Thumb2bar

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 07:35 PM

Isnt that a long block? 



#32 Daag44

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 07:38 PM

What was the difference between the $2,300 and $3,000 version? I assume this is shortblock vs longblock.


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#33 xcrsp440

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 07:38 PM

New engines are so pretty.

#34 mc670

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Posted 18 February 2020 - 06:17 PM

Update: Never got many pictures of the re-assembly, wouldn't all too bad. The most misery if you ask me was re-attaching the oil lines to the bottom end, routing the stator wiring and vacuum lines for the raves. Sled is currently at the dealer awaiting to be hooked up to BUDs to get everything set up to fire. Anxious to see how it goes!

 

 

f37b8b0ddc9e0280e88e96e163d0ded1.jpg87178247a14ee839194f99beb8a6abfe.jpgccac5638886c1afd1f417180799947d8.jpg

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Edited by mc670, 19 February 2020 - 07:26 AM.

Mark

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2018 Chevy Silverado Rally Edition CCSB 5.3L

2014 Ski-doo Renegade Backcounty X, 800etec

2013 Can-am Renegade X-Xc 800R

1983 Ski-doo Elan 250 single (resto project)


#35 mc670

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Posted 19 February 2020 - 10:45 AM

What was the difference between the $2,300 and $3,000 version? I assume this is shortblock vs longblock.

 

I'm unsure to be honest, The crate this engine came in said on the tag "shortblock with head" which makes no sense to be really. It's a longblock if you ask me.  This is the $3000 option, I insisted on getting the shortblock without the head but I was told they were unable to get me one. Unsure if it's discontinued or what the deal was there. :unsure:


Mark

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2018 Chevy Silverado Rally Edition CCSB 5.3L

2014 Ski-doo Renegade Backcounty X, 800etec

2013 Can-am Renegade X-Xc 800R

1983 Ski-doo Elan 250 single (resto project)


#36 Daag44

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Posted 19 February 2020 - 01:11 PM

I'm unsure to be honest, The crate this engine came in said on the tag "shortblock with head" which makes no sense to be really. It's a longblock if you ask me.  This is the $3000 option, I insisted on getting the shortblock without the head but I was told they were unable to get me one. Unsure if it's discontinued or what the deal was there. :unsure:


Thanks for the info.


Edited by Daag44, 22 February 2020 - 07:07 PM.

Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#37 mc670

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Posted 21 February 2020 - 08:35 PM

Another follow up, Sled is up and running! Install wouldn't all too bad aside from getting all the wiring/hoses routed correctly. Dealer surprisingly only charged me $60 to program both new injectors, bleed the oil pump, set the raves and put it in break in mode.

Slapped on the 1+1 seat for a ride with the girlfriend tonight and put a lil over 30 km's so on the new engine. It's running great so far! Hoping it stays that way. Only bug is my starter seems to have died, but i can live with that for now.f683220d6d4dbda425005a21ddc36c95.jpgc1f42410fb5633e7fac9c1d6cfe73de7.jpg

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Edited by mc670, 21 February 2020 - 08:40 PM.

Mark

____________________________________________________________

 

2018 Chevy Silverado Rally Edition CCSB 5.3L

2014 Ski-doo Renegade Backcounty X, 800etec

2013 Can-am Renegade X-Xc 800R

1983 Ski-doo Elan 250 single (resto project)


#38 Daag44

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Posted 22 February 2020 - 10:45 PM

"Only bug is my starter seems to have died, but i can live with that for now."
 
I wonder if this is the same symptom that kept the battery from charging and led to the injector not fueling the mag side correctly. I remember two new injectors were bought on e Bay and the stator may have needed to be replaced. In any case it is worth testing the 12Vdc and 60Vdc systems, and also ensure the mag and pto sides are burning evenly. Those are two of the three things I use as an insurance of sorts.


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#39 mc670

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 08:00 PM

"Only bug is my starter seems to have died, but i can live with that for now."
 
I wonder if this is the same symptom that kept the battery from charging and led to the injector not fueling the mag side correctly. I remember two new injectors were bought on e Bay and the stator may have needed to be replaced. In any case it is worth testing the 12Vdc and 60Vdc systems, and also ensure the mag and pto sides are burning evenly. Those are two of the three things I use as an insurance of sorts.

 

I actually broke out my multimeter and tested both as soon as I got it back and running, all ok and the battery is charging right where it should be at 14.3 +/-. I did replace the stator as well. I think that the starter issue maybe a coincidence, I'm pretty sure I ruined the starter the prior day of it blowing up trying to get it running at -35 temps. (I forgot to bench test it in all the chaos of putting it together.) Electrically everything checks out fine right to the starter but it's a no go.

 

So far nearly 100km's on the engine and its been running excellent. I have been taking it easy on the engine, My plan when I get a few more km's on it I'm going to pull the plug's and see how they are burning.


Mark

____________________________________________________________

 

2018 Chevy Silverado Rally Edition CCSB 5.3L

2014 Ski-doo Renegade Backcounty X, 800etec

2013 Can-am Renegade X-Xc 800R

1983 Ski-doo Elan 250 single (resto project)


#40 Daag44

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 08:54 PM

I actually broke out my multimeter and tested both as soon as I got it back and running, all ok and the battery is charging right where it should be at 14.3 +/-. I did replace the stator as well. I think that the starter issue maybe a coincidence, I'm pretty sure I ruined the starter the prior day of it blowing up trying to get it running at -35 temps. (I forgot to bench test it in all the chaos of putting it together.) Electrically everything checks out fine right to the starter but it's a no go.
 
So far nearly 100km's on the engine and its been running excellent. I have been taking it easy on the engine, My plan when I get a few more km's on it I'm going to pull the plug's and see how they are burning.


You really did take all precautions on this build and I think you are off to a good start. The only thing left will be to check the bolts for looseness after a certain amount of riding. The ones that I find are prone to loosening from vibration or heat are the battery connections, the y-pipe bolts, the nuts holding the RAVE guillotine, and the clutch bolt. It is worth giving the 3 ground points a quick check too.


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
850 Center Oil line for coolant pump melted
850 Main Oil line caught fire #1 and #2
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's and Ronn's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses of a failed ECM
Electrical - Solder vs Crimp
Electrical Diagram for Fanners on page 3
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Electric Start troubleshooting
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC eRAVE position code recurring
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
E-TEC Voltage Rectifier Regulator troubleshooting
E-TEC Power Fades are not normal and can be fixed
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 Steering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Longevity - 800R E-TEC 
Mikuni o-ring for carb float assembly - Arctic Cat part# 6505-875 or from Amazon and eBay
Muffler Red Hot
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pictures - How to post with the correct orientation
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Power Loss - How to diagnose in the field
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Spark Plugs cracked
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator Removal on page 3
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#41 shokman

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Posted 26 February 2020 - 12:01 PM

Stumbled on this thread and find it interesting so will make a few comments on my experiences with P-Tek not E-Tek, I have done several doo 700, 800 original twins and several P-Teks. I used to have a local buddy that did cranks and could buy Weisco pistons fairly cheap which is how original builds were done. However the original engines were always taking out con rod bearing and sometimes resulting damage quite often required rebuilt cylinder. These problems increased cost. I have also gone the CV-Tech way with a rebuild. For my own P-Tek I bought Doo shortblock for about $2200, and found that no way was this a REBUILD, several places on block that Rotax uses self tapping screws ( intake and stator shroud ) had no threads in them??? Got to thinking that doo goes through so many of these engines that not worth there time or effort to rebuild. No way these would make sense being done in EU by Rotax, and doubt very much they would reman in Valcourt. Cores I'm betting all go to CV-Tech. The last one I did for a buddy we were able get new cases, his were damaged from con rod, and rebuilt crank for $900 plus some shipping. Luckily monoblock was okay so weisco pistons and gaskets etc was about another $500. So in the end with my free labour engine ready to go in sled, he was in for about $1500. Now keep in mind he bought 2009 Summit knowing engine was blown I think for about $1500. So he's in now for $3000. for a sled that is worth not much more than that around here. But if he can get enough use out of it it will be affordable. The moral of this story is I truly believe that a crate engine from Doo is by far the best way to go if anybody plans on using sled lond enough to justify $2500 ish if they can re & re themselves. I believe E-Tek is couple hundy more than P-Tek but in most of Canada probably $25ish. 


Edited by shokman, 26 February 2020 - 12:03 PM.


#42 mc670

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Posted 01 March 2020 - 06:25 PM

Stumbled on this thread and find it interesting so will make a few comments on my experiences with P-Tek not E-Tek, I have done several doo 700, 800 original twins and several P-Teks. I used to have a local buddy that did cranks and could buy Weisco pistons fairly cheap which is how original builds were done. However the original engines were always taking out con rod bearing and sometimes resulting damage quite often required rebuilt cylinder. These problems increased cost. I have also gone the CV-Tech way with a rebuild. For my own P-Tek I bought Doo shortblock for about $2200, and found that no way was this a REBUILD, several places on block that Rotax uses self tapping screws ( intake and stator shroud ) had no threads in them??? Got to thinking that doo goes through so many of these engines that not worth there time or effort to rebuild. No way these would make sense being done in EU by Rotax, and doubt very much they would reman in Valcourt. Cores I'm betting all go to CV-Tech. The last one I did for a buddy we were able get new cases, his were damaged from con rod, and rebuilt crank for $900 plus some shipping. Luckily monoblock was okay so weisco pistons and gaskets etc was about another $500. So in the end with my free labour engine ready to go in sled, he was in for about $1500. Now keep in mind he bought 2009 Summit knowing engine was blown I think for about $1500. So he's in now for $3000. for a sled that is worth not much more than that around here. But if he can get enough use out of it it will be affordable. The moral of this story is I truly believe that a crate engine from Doo is by far the best way to go if anybody plans on using sled lond enough to justify $2500 ish if they can re & re themselves. I believe E-Tek is couple hundy more than P-Tek but in most of Canada probably $25ish. 

Around $3000 all said and done for this engine (that's with the core return.)  If i have more time and my own garage to work in, i would have rebuilt my old engine in a flash. But i don't regret this choice. I had my sled back up in much less time plus the warranty on this one gives me peace of mind. All in all if i had known this was going to happen, i would have been far better off having a brand new sled instead of trying to save a few bucks. But that's it, it's the gamble you taking buying second hand.

 

As of today, 250km's on the new engine. running excellent :D


Mark

____________________________________________________________

 

2018 Chevy Silverado Rally Edition CCSB 5.3L

2014 Ski-doo Renegade Backcounty X, 800etec

2013 Can-am Renegade X-Xc 800R

1983 Ski-doo Elan 250 single (resto project)


#43 DTXRSB

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Posted 01 March 2020 - 11:26 PM

How much was the core charge?






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