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Too much oil used

850 oil oil pump ecm Summit

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#16 Daag44

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Posted 28 November 2019 - 10:01 PM

I would carefully go back & verify this, mark the tank level before & after. Make sure the sled is in the same level plan before & after. If it is true should be easy identify the culprit.

 

As far as your coolant levels I don't see any connection to the oil unless you have had to add. It's normal for the level to change as the system develops heat & pressure....release the pressure & the level will return to normal.

 

By chance have you checked to see if pressure is building in the oil tank?

 

Well said! Graduating the oil tank is also an excellent idea.

 

For the coolant level, if you have ever connected a vacuum/pressure gauge to the coolant tank vent with an unpressurized cap on a two stroke sled, I imagine that you have noticed it draws a vacuum as you depress the throttle. It is one of the rare subjects that have yet to surface on DooTalk other than what can be expected for the coolant level as the norm. Usually the only explanations given are those for automobiles which don't directly translate to our two strokes because of the difference in the pressure cap.


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#17 eternalwinter

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 02:37 AM

I would carefully go back & verify this, mark the tank level before & after. Make sure the sled is in the same level plan before & after. If it is true should be easy identify the culprit.

 

As far as your coolant levels I don't see any connection to the oil unless you have had to add. It's normal for the level to change as the system develops heat & pressure....release the pressure & the level will return to normal.

 

By chance have you checked to see if pressure is building in the oil tank?

 

I did mark the tank at full and refilled it to that level each time with a measure cup.  That's how I got the 26:1.  It definitely started using more oil at the end of the season than what it had through out the rest of the season, even during break in. I did not check for pressure in the oil tank but I did verify that there was oil in the line to the water pump gear.



#18 ROBGROTTO

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 09:36 AM

Dont attack me for this ! But what tells the oil pump to pump more oil ? The TPS ? if the TPS was outta wack (range) it would hopefully be an easy reset 



#19 eternalwinter

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:11 PM

I did check the tps, was correct. The only controllers in the system are ECM and the pump... and they replaced both.

#20 ROBGROTTO

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:20 PM

Thank you



#21 Daag44

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 05:12 PM

I posted this in the Summit side too...  So, I have a 2019 Summit 850 X.  Rode it about 950 miles last season without issue one until it started smoking like we were fogging for mosquitos.  It was strange though, start up in the mornings letting it warm up it looked normal with no extra smokiness but after running for a bit, stop, shut down for a couple of minutes or 10 and on start up it would just billow the smoke out.  Start running and it would clear up.  Started tracking the oil use and it was about 26:1.  Checked it twice during basic trail rides and it stayed about the same.  Took it to the dealer, they changed the oil pump, got it back with the same results.  Took it back, they tested everything from end to end and BRP told them to change the ECM.  Did that but still smoking and using an excessive amount of oil.  I have another 850 that is still in break in mode that doesn't smoke this much and uses less oil. 

 

Any ideas out there?  Thanks.


On the bold, yes, absolutely.

 

Drop the oil level to the half mark and see if it is still consuming the same amount of oil.


Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#22 Daag44

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 05:29 PM

Assuming there are no visible leaks, which the dealer or yourself would have caught, and assuming that any fuel/oil mapping issues was eliminated when both the ECM and oil pump were replaced, then that leaves only one possibility, the engine needs to be replaced. If this is the case, then the faster you know, the least riding time you will loose when the snow hits the ground.
 
At the point you are at, it is very easy and it will take just one ride to figure it out for yourself. Drop the oil level to the half mark, then accurately measure the oil and fuel consumption for the mileage ridden.

Air/Fuel Ratio for two and four strokes
Air/Fuel Ratio for 1200 with boost
Air/Fuel Ratio is measured through emissions
Wideband and EGT
Wideband readings of Air/Fuel Ratio on a two stroke
600 SDI MY2004 Lean/Hot spot running 6900-7000 rpm @ 40-45% Throttle Opening
800R Cranking Compression
800R Oil Injection / Premix combo
800R Turbo?
900 ACE Turbo - muffler turning red hot
1200 4-TEC Mapping
1200 4-TEC MY 2009 to 2011 Fuel Line issues that could cause a fire
Batteries
Belt Blowers: Overview of UPMICHIGANDER's experience
BUDS 3.3.0 won't connect to SDI
BUDS not connecting to HO or SDI - Try a CanDoo
CVT efficiency - BlueMax
Deep snow intake for XP chassis
Diagnoses
E-TEC 600HO Clutching
E-TEC Oil Pump
E-TEC Dial-A-Jet
E-TEC Engine Management
E-TEC Stator fault codes P1562 or P1563
E-TEC Capacitor Charge Hold Test and Residual Voltage Test
Fuel Issues: Could new Ester type oxygenated additives be deteriorating the Fuel Sender Grommet?
Fuel pump and regulator replacement for ACE, E-TEC and SDI
Gasoline quality and storage
Bad Gas for a Two Stroke - Is it a Myth ?
G4 Clutch Alignment, Engine Movement, Sheave Runout and Clutching
GNR CVT Alignment for the G4
Grip N Rip Clutch Alignment testing
G4 850 Throttle Jerkiness solved with clutching
G4 850 Snappy throttle/clutch engagement
G4 850 pDrive tech - A question of Engineering
G4 850 Tuned Pipe @ 12.6 lbs and Muffler @ 15.4 lbs vs 800R and 800RE muffler weight
Pictures - How to resize and upload to DooTalk
Pipe Pressure testing on a dyno
Pipe Pressure testing from LRD (#1) and (#2)
Pipe Pressure testing results from BRP
Oil versus Fuel consumption
Power at the Crankshaft vs Track - BlueMax
Power Curves: 600 HOE (E-TEC)
Power Curves: 600 vs 800 vs 850 vs 1000 vs 1200
Power Curves: 1000 vs 800 vs 600
Power curves: 800RE 2010.5 to 2016 vs 2016.5 850
Quebec/NY State border crossing
REV Gen1 Gauge Display stuck on "SCALE"
REV Gen1 Volt and Temp Gauge install
REV Gen1 electrical connectors for sensors and MPEM (Multi Purpose Engine Module)
Seafoam for E-TEC injectors
Shortblock or Rebuild?
Ski-Doo Snowmobile Tech Training
Stator testing for E-TEC using a T harness/Bridge
Stator testing for 1200 4-TEC
Stator replacement for a 1200 4-TEC
Suspension Adjustment
Triples - Coolant Pump Assembly
Y-Pipe bolts loosening fix


#23 ctdls

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Posted 29 November 2019 - 06:22 PM

  On the oil side, the tank went down about 3/8" in the 10-12 min of off and on idle time while switching parts. 

 

You stated in 10-12 minutes the oil level went down 3/8's..................correct or I'm I reading this wrong? That is mucho oil, if it is true it should be straight forward to diagnose....... that is what you need to verify. You don't need to drive it.







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