29 replies to this topic

[Fastrack]

Hi all,

Right now I'm running the stock plugs and have another set for emergency purposes. But looking at the shop manual and the user guide they both say to replace the plugs pre-season.

1) What is the point of replacing the plugs? Don't plugs last longer than 1 year? Or does the fogging oil mess them up? (Says the same thing for my 4tec Sea-doo as well.. what gives)
2) What are the best plugs for this motor ('09 500ss with 1200km's) - it's stock with no mods. Is there an ngk iridium plug for this engine?

Should I get ngk iridium's if they exist and keep the backups as backups And trash last season plugs? Or run out one tank of fuel (I have a 1/4 tank of stabilized fuel and I'm going to top it up with fresh fuel before riding) and change the plugs?

Ben

[snake_eyes]

You'll probably hear people telling you to change to BR9ECS from the stock 10's...don't do it unless you re-jet as I've heard the stock engine settings are pretty lean to begin with. I just picked up the Iridium plug BR10EiX and can't tell you anything until it snows - do a google search to find where to purchase...I will tell you that in 08, the stock jetting was 390 mains, 17.5 pilots vs. in 2009, 420 mains, 17.5 pilots (at least this is how my wife's 500SS GSX was setup). I ended up trying different jets / pilots and found 420 mains, 20 pilots with a 1 1/2 turn on the fuel screw to give the best settings on the stand without any hanging idle...we'll see when it snows and get's colder...I may have to tweak it...

Definitely get a few sets of plugs as the 08 and 09 500SS versions have tended to foul plugs...what oil do you plan on running?

[Fastrack]

You'll probably hear people telling you to change to BR9ECS from the stock 10's...don't do it unless you re-jet as I've heard the stock engine settings are pretty lean to begin with. I just picked up the Iridium plug BR10EiX and can't tell you anything until it snows - do a google search to find where to purchase...I will tell you that in 08, the stock jetting was 390 mains, 17.5 pilots vs. in 2009, 420 mains, 17.5 pilots (at least this is how my wife's 500SS GSX was setup). I ended up trying different jets / pilots and found 420 mains, 20 pilots with a 1 1/2 turn on the fuel screw to give the best settings on the stand without any hanging idle...we'll see when it snows and get's colder...I may have to tweak it...

Definitely get a few sets of plugs as the 08 and 09 500SS versions have tended to foul plugs...what oil do you plan on running?

Well jetting is over my head - this is my first sled - Purchased it new in January '09. I ran bulk BRP semisynthetic oil from my dealer for 1200km's didn't foul any plugs and had no issues. I guess i gotta figure out this jetting stuff.

I do sometimes have a hanging throttle when I pull to a stop. So the BR10EiX is the right plug? I tried going to NGK's site and picked engine block 593 according to the shoip manual and I couldn't find the plug.

Do you change the plugs every year? Is it required? There's also a BR10EiX-Solid?

Ben

[snake_eyes]

Well jetting is over my head - this is my first sled - Purchased it new in January '09. I ran bulk BRP semisynthetic oil from my dealer for 1200km's didn't foul any plugs and had no issues. I guess i gotta figure out this jetting stuff.

I do sometimes have a hanging throttle when I pull to a stop. So the BR10EiX is the right plug? I tried going to NGK's site and picked engine block 593 according to the shoip manual and I couldn't find the plug.

Do you change the plugs every year? Is it required? There's also a BR10EiX-Solid?

Ben

If you didn't foul any plugs using the semi-synthetic & the stock BR10ECS, then just stick with them - BR10EiX are the right replacement - same heat range and from what my doo dealer told me, not sure what you mean by solid? Regarding changing plugs, it depends...since I fog my engine every spring, I start with a fresh set of plugs after I clean my carbs in the fall...won't hurt to change them every year, for the cost, probably worth it.

[Johnny Torque]

I got my 08 TNT dialed in last year (Jets/ shims/ Tempa Flow) and I ran BR10ES plugs and didn't have any issues and they are a heck of alot cheaper than what you guys are talking about. I really think you don't need to spend the long dollar on plugs if it's running correctly. Good Luck.

[Fastrack]

Yep no issues with fouling at all last year, now I do run mid-grade (89) in my sled not sure if that makes a difference. The BR10EiX-Solid part # was found on a google search for BR10EiX. Let me know how the iX plugs work out though it would be interesting to see if there's any difference.

Anyone gap the plugs or just use the factory setting on the BR10ECS's?

Ben

[Fastrack]

I just spoke to NGK and they said the correct replacement for the BR10ECS is BR10ECMiX - The "EiX" above is a shorter plug - and the ECMiX is an exact replacement. Same heat range and everything. Now to find a place that sells it

EDIT: Searching the NET it seems the ECMiX is $18!! vs $8 for the "EiX"

Ben

[marc_brown98]

plugs tend to get crapped up when a motor is fogged down correctly, that's why they advise to replace plugs. Its a good practice to do anyway, even though a plug might not be fouled to the point of not firing, it doesn't mean its firing perfectly like a new plug. I observed it during some dyno runs on my engine. For what its worth, I run BR9EYA's on my rev 662, gapped at .016.

[snake_eyes]

I just spoke to NGK and they said the correct replacement for the BR10ECS is BR10ECMiX - The "EiX" above is a shorter plug - and the ECMiX is an exact replacement. Same heat range and everything. Now to find a place that sells it

EDIT: Searching the NET it seems the ECMiX is $18!! vs $8 for the "EiX"

Ben

Hmmm, I think my dealer may have ordered me the wrong plug. Here is the info from the NGK website (according to their "plug number" id chart): http://www.ngk.com/s...anufacturerID=1

BR10EIX vs. BR10ECMIX

B = thread size, hex side...both are at 14mm / 13/16"
R = Resistor type plug
10 = heat of the plug
E = Thread reach, both are at 19mm (3/4")
CM = Compact type, low angle ground electrode
IX = High performance Iridium

So they are the same length and reach. However, they do look different as the "EIX" is straight walled up to where the Ceramic & electrode sticks out, whereas the ECMIX looks "identical" to the BR10ECS (the "S" here stands for the standard 2.5mm center electrode).

If you see the word "solid" after the plug (i.e. BR10EIX-Solid) that means the terminal is fixed and is not the aluminum "screw" type. I found a bunch of places that sell the BR10ECMIX on line - just do a google search.

They do cost more...however, if it means not fouling or less likely to foul, worth the shot.

[Pit Grunt]

RUN the BR10ES. Did some testing two years ago,And the wash is better on the piston with the BR10ES.....

[Fastrack]

Hmmm, I think my dealer may have ordered me the wrong plug. Here is the info from the NGK website (according to their "plug number" id chart): http://www.ngk.com/s...anufacturerID=1

BR10EIX vs. BR10ECMIX

B = thread size, hex side...both are at 14mm / 13/16"
R = Resistor type plug
10 = heat of the plug
E = Thread reach, both are at 19mm (3/4")
CM = Compact type, low angle ground electrode
IX = High performance Iridium

So they are the same length and reach. However, they do look different as the "EIX" is straight walled up to where the Ceramic & electrode sticks out, whereas the ECMIX looks "identical" to the BR10ECS (the "S" here stands for the standard 2.5mm center electrode).

If you see the word "solid" after the plug (i.e. BR10EIX-Solid) that means the terminal is fixed and is not the aluminum "screw" type. I found a bunch of places that sell the BR10ECMIX on line - just do a google search.

They do cost more...however, if it means not fouling or less likely to foul, worth the shot.

Yeah I tried to figure out the chart. But I had no idea what "CM" really meant. But I guess they both have "C" which is a low angle ground electrode. I originally phoned NGK to determine where to buy them! I figured while on the phone see if he could check the iX cross the reference! He spent quite a bit of time on it. I think he said the ceramic portion was slightly larger in diameter compared to the EiX. According to the person at NGK he said that the ECMIX is fixed terminal at the top (as he asked me if that mattered). I haven't been able to determine the real difference between the 2 (as the price is quite a bit different). I'm going to call them back tomorrow and figure out the difference.

Ben

[snake_eyes]

Post what you find please. I've sent them an email asking some questions...I'll do the same when I find out...

[Fastrack]

Post what you find please. I've sent them an email asking some questions...I'll do the same when I find out...

Okay so I phoned them again, according to NGK he said
- both EiX and ECMiX are the same HEX
- EiX protrudes 1.2mm more into the cylinder than the ECMiX (same as the ECS). I'm not sure if 1.2mm will make a difference??

The internals of ECMiX are a bit different and EiX is more of an automotive plug - higher production rate vs ECMiX is a special sport plug. So that's why there's a price difference. (Firing wise he said there wouldn't be much of a difference)


Ben

[Salmonbum]

I have an '07 500ss, which was a yr they were prone to burn down in the mid range. Put about 1300 miles on it with no problem, but I wanted to do what I could to not have one. I did have a hanging idle after long runs, so I did shimmed the needle .020", tunr screws out 2 full turns (1.5 was stock), run 91-93 octane and switched plugs to 10ECS. Ran this combo all last yr in temps down to -22° F with nor probs. the hanging idles "almost" went away. Not 100% gone, but not a big deal, when it does it's minor. Mileage went down alittle, now 16-17 mpg with girl at the bars.

As for changing plugs, I usually fog the heck outta my sleds in the spring. I thing start the sled up in the fall a few times before 1st ride. I leave those plugs in for 1st ride, just to make sure all the junk is burned out, then replace with fresh plugs. The old ones will still work fine to get ya home, so I keep them for backups.

[Fastrack]

As for changing plugs, I usually fog the heck outta my sleds in the spring. I thing start the sled up in the fall a few times before 1st ride. I leave those plugs in for 1st ride, just to make sure all the junk is burned out, then replace with fresh plugs. The old ones will still work fine to get ya home, so I keep them for backups.

My plan is to use the "old plugs" and use them to fog the machine. I just phoned NGK USA instead of NGK Canada and he said the same thing BR10ECMiX is the correct plug. EiX is not vibration Resistant - the "C" in the part means that. Because of this the ground "could" fall off the BR10EiX - not a good thing! The ECMiX is not 100% a replacement but it's the closest they have.

The "CM" means compact, so the ceramic portion is a little shorter - I can't remember the plug boots but I think there was still space once it was installed.

Ben